1 2 > 
 
   
 

Less Religion in the Military?

 
Sapere Aude
 
Avatar
 
 
Sapere Aude
Total Posts:  8
Joined  28-04-2012
 
 
 
04 May 2012 07:00
 

So I’m not even sure if this is feasible, but here it is:

I’m in the U.S. Navy and every night while we’re underway they do the same thing.  TVs, computers and all other activities shut down temporarily so that we can have our “evening prayer”.  Now, I have no issue with people expressing their faiths as long as its not in a violent way (which, unfortunately, isn’t often the case), but I don’t think that we should all be forced to go through it.  I personally find it offensive and when I tried to bring it up to my chain of command, they acted like I was the one who was crazy and just being a troublemaker. 

I have no idea if Project Reason can reach to places like a ship in the middle of the ocean, but if they can, I would appreciate a little help here lol!

If not, though, I would love to hear some advice as to how I should handle this?  Any suggestions are welcome.

 
 
SkepticX
 
Avatar
 
 
SkepticX
Total Posts:  14817
Joined  24-12-2004
 
 
 
04 May 2012 10:06
 
 
 
Sapere Aude
 
Avatar
 
 
Sapere Aude
Total Posts:  8
Joined  28-04-2012
 
 
 
04 May 2012 14:26
 

Hey thanks.  I think this might really help.  It will at least give me better ways to maybe approach my chain of command about some of this. 

Much appreciated.

 
 
goodgraydrab
 
Avatar
 
 
goodgraydrab
Total Posts:  7845
Joined  19-12-2007
 
 
 
04 May 2012 15:05
 
Sapere Aude - 04 May 2012 05:00 AM

If not, though, I would love to hear some advice as to how I should handle this?  Any suggestions are welcome.

Ignore it and continue to play Bid Whist on the mess deck with your local group of militant Black Panthers.

 
 
TheBrotherMario
 
Avatar
 
 
TheBrotherMario
Total Posts:  4488
Joined  02-04-2011
 
 
 
05 May 2012 00:54
 

Yeah, prayer time sucks when it distracts from earthly things, like pornography, or, even worse, makes one think about whether or not some things, like pornography, are even something you should be watching.

No. You should be free to do what you want, and, when your complete freedom is jeopardized, make up stories about the danger of prayer—there are about 10 million good religious people for every terrorist, while in the secular world, it’s about 10 thousand to one.

Maybe your superiors will change the Navy’s slogan for you from, “A Global Force For Good”, to, “A Global Force For Reason”.

Pick a fight with the real enemy, sir—i.e., ignorance of truth.

[ Edited: 05 May 2012 00:56 by TheBrotherMario]
 
 
Sapere Aude
 
Avatar
 
 
Sapere Aude
Total Posts:  8
Joined  28-04-2012
 
 
 
05 May 2012 06:15
 

Yeah, prayer time sucks when it distracts from earthly things, like pornography, or, even worse, makes one think about whether or not some things, like pornography, are even something you should be watching.

No. You should be free to do what you want, and, when your complete freedom is jeopardized, make up stories about the danger of prayer—there are about 10 million good religious people for every terrorist, while in the secular world, it’s about 10 thousand to one.

Maybe your superiors will change the Navy’s slogan for you from, “A Global Force For Good”, to, “A Global Force For Reason”.

Firstly, I have no idea how pornography came into the picture at all.  I won’t even dignify that with a reply.

Secondly, the slogan change would be great.  Plenty of horrible, nightmarish and unforgivable things have been done in the name of ‘‘good’.  Whereas, I have yet to hear of a monstrosity on the scale the Holocaust or the Crusades done in the name of ‘‘reason’‘.  So yes, I think that would be a positive change in the Navy.

 
 
MARTIN_UK
 
Avatar
 
 
MARTIN_UK
Total Posts:  4911
Joined  19-08-2010
 
 
 
05 May 2012 09:11
 
Sapere Aude - 05 May 2012 04:15 AM

Yeah, prayer time sucks when it distracts from earthly things, like pornography, or, even worse, makes one think about whether or not some things, like pornography, are even something you should be watching.

No. You should be free to do what you want, and, when your complete freedom is jeopardized, make up stories about the danger of prayer—there are about 10 million good religious people for every terrorist, while in the secular world, it’s about 10 thousand to one.

Maybe your superiors will change the Navy’s slogan for you from, “A Global Force For Good”, to, “A Global Force For Reason”.

Firstly, I have no idea how pornography came into the picture at all.  I won’t even dignify that with a reply.

Secondly, the slogan change would be great.  Plenty of horrible, nightmarish and unforgivable things have been done in the name of ‘‘good’.  Whereas, I have yet to hear of a monstrosity on the scale the Holocaust or the Crusades done in the name of ‘‘reason’‘.  So yes, I think that would be a positive change in the Navy.

And there we have it, Mario introduces himself to you Sapere, in the only way he can.

His initials “BM”, always live up to the Bowel Movements he produces here on a regular basis, at least you could smell his shit before it even hit the deck and that’s a credit to you….Welcome to the forum.

 
TheBrotherMario
 
Avatar
 
 
TheBrotherMario
Total Posts:  4488
Joined  02-04-2011
 
 
 
05 May 2012 09:48
 

Any person who denigrates prayer, or its true name, spirituality, is the one who is full of shit.

Every atrocity humanity has ever experienced can be traced to the minds of men, not to the spirituality of men.

Spirituality gets us deep inside ourselves and our thoughts on reality. And very few people find murder and hatred there.

You boys are clueless. You have zero experience with true spirituality, or, for that matter, anything above a superficial glance at reality, yet you deem yourselves talented and wise enough to correct human traditions rooted in deep wisdom.

Look in the mirror and correct that guy, for you’re not the powerhouse of thought you think you are; just opinionated and seeking attention and ignorant of much.

Welcome to Project Wake The Fuck Up.

 
 
MARTIN_UK
 
Avatar
 
 
MARTIN_UK
Total Posts:  4911
Joined  19-08-2010
 
 
 
05 May 2012 10:23
 
TheBrotherMario - 05 May 2012 07:48 AM

Any person who denigrates prayer, or its true name, spirituality, is the one who is full of shit…

Not sure which OP you are reading…

Sapere Aude - 04 May 2012 05:00 AM

Now, I have no issue with people expressing their faiths as long as its not in a violent way (which, unfortunately, isn’t often the case), but I don’t think that we should all be forced to go through it.

He signed up to serve on a Warship not in a Monastery, so being forced to follow any religious ritual is not in his job description.
No problem if you want to pray, but pointless if you don’t follow any particular belief, or do you actually think he should just pray anyway…

Don’t know why I’m bothering, I know the response will be distorted and won’t address the OP or my point in question, back to me not bothering with you I think Mario….sorry.

 
Sapere Aude
 
Avatar
 
 
Sapere Aude
Total Posts:  8
Joined  28-04-2012
 
 
 
05 May 2012 14:40
 

yet you deem yourselves talented and wise enough to correct human traditions rooted in deep wisdom.

Genital mutilation, torture, death by fire, sexism, racism, tribalism, violence, terrorism, irrational thought, mind control, genocide, the killing of homosexuals, child/spousal abuse… etc.

If you consider those things “traditions rooted in deep wisdom”, then you are hopelessly twisted and I will no longer even make an attempt to respect your beliefs.  I wonder if you’ve actually read your “holy” book, Mario.  You claim wisdom, but all it gives is chaos. 

You claim that I’m out for attention?  You’re on a secular site arguing for god… who’s looking for attention?  I fit right in here.  Just one in the crowd.  You, on the other hand, stick out like a VERY sore thumb… you won’t have my attention though.  I have more deserving focal points in my life.

Thank you, Martin and goodbye, Mario.

 
 
SkepticX
 
Avatar
 
 
SkepticX
Total Posts:  14817
Joined  24-12-2004
 
 
 
05 May 2012 17:23
 

Mario’s a biological AI with faulty programming.

There’s really no point in attempting anything like rational or honest dialog with him.

 
 
Sapere Aude
 
Avatar
 
 
Sapere Aude
Total Posts:  8
Joined  28-04-2012
 
 
 
05 May 2012 19:18
 

Mario’s a biological AI with faulty programming.

There’s really no point in attempting anything like rational or honest dialog with him.

Haha seems legit.  He’s obviously not thinking for himself so I could easily agree that he’s programmed lol

 
 
godisnot
 
Avatar
 
 
godisnot
Total Posts:  1
Joined  28-09-2008
 
 
 
21 May 2012 17:47
 

Sapere touches on a point that annoys me as well and I commend his decision to question it with his chain of cammand.  The microcosm that is his ship is duplicated throughout our society.  News organizations tout stories of ‘miraculous’ survival and god’s hand in daily life.  Public meetings begin with opening prayers and end with benedictions. Athletes thank illusory gods on national television for the gifts that enable them to vanquish the believers on the other team.  When opinions like these are voiced in such commonplace arenas as the evening news or a football game, the continued theistic indoctrination of the masses is enhanced. (see, Mario). It is not difficult to visualize god-fearing parents consuming these reports of metaphysical stimuli and positing them with their gullible offspring as substantiation that these phenomena surround every collective move and confirm the existence of their god of choice. The President of the United States closes all of his prepared remarks with something like the following;
God bless the victims/soldiers (and sailors)/champions/heroes/etc.  God bless you and god bless the United States of America.

Adding these words to every discourse contributes to a hostile environment for anyone that doesn’t share the illusion.  Yet even POTUS calls the flock to the fantasy.  Fortunately, he clearly doesn’t wait for divine intervention in taking military or political action which is an improvement over some of his predecessors.  As the leader of my secular nation and the Commander in Chief, I appreciate his responsibility and the effort he exerts in fulfilling it.  But I must assert my hope that his words are a political necessity and his piety is feigned for the sake of future votes.  (Refutation of SH’s treatise in “Lying”, saved for another day.)

I realize I leave questions.  Can new media or new uses of existing media be developed for conveying reasonable alternatives to religion?  Are the old god memes so firmly entrenched in our existing communication resources that they are now beyond rescue by the sanity of reason?  What more can be be done to stifle the absurd voices of the faithful?

However formidable the obstacle, the rational unbelievers must use all of our imperfect delivery systems and combat the spread of dogma. Our desire for some future prevalence of a reasonable and logical worldview must drive us to seek new methods for dispelling the myths and articulating the shortcomings of religious faith.  We cannot simply cry ‘bullshit’ in our solitude and be done with it.  We must exploit whatever media are at our disposal.  We must maximize our unity of purpose and refute religious zeal with equal passion.  We must continue to further our own media, question our obligation to endure the verbalization by the faithful and offer alternatives to the unsubstantiated platitudes of Christianity and all religions.

 
Andrew
 
Avatar
 
 
Andrew
Total Posts:  9231
Joined  15-06-2006
 
 
 
21 May 2012 19:12
 
gguidas - 21 May 2012 03:47 PM

Sapere touches on a point that annoys me as well and I commend his decision to question it with his chain of cammand.  The microcosm that is his ship is duplicated throughout our society.  News organizations tout stories of ‘miraculous’ survival and god’s hand in daily life.  Public meetings begin with opening prayers and end with benedictions. Athletes thank illusory gods on national television for the gifts that enable them to vanquish the believers on the other team.  When opinions like these are voiced in such commonplace arenas as the evening news or a football game, the continued theistic indoctrination of the masses is enhanced. (see, Mario). It is not difficult to visualize god-fearing parents consuming these reports of metaphysical stimuli and positing them with their gullible offspring as substantiation that these phenomena surround every collective move and confirm the existence of their god of choice. The President of the United States closes all of his prepared remarks with something like the following;
God bless the victims/soldiers (and sailors)/champions/heroes/etc.  God bless you and god bless the United States of America.

Adding these words to every discourse contributes to a hostile environment for anyone that doesn’t share the illusion.  Yet even POTUS calls the flock to the fantasy.  Fortunately, he clearly doesn’t wait for divine intervention in taking military or political action which is an improvement over some of his predecessors.  As the leader of my secular nation and the Commander in Chief, I appreciate his responsibility and the effort he exerts in fulfilling it.  But I must assert my hope that his words are a political necessity and his piety is feigned for the sake of future votes.  (Refutation of SH’s treatise in “Lying”, saved for another day.)

I realize I leave questions.  Can new media or new uses of existing media be developed for conveying reasonable alternatives to religion?  Are the old god memes so firmly entrenched in our existing communication resources that they are now beyond rescue by the sanity of reason?  What more can be be done to stifle the absurd voices of the faithful?

However formidable the obstacle, the rational unbelievers must use all of our imperfect delivery systems and combat the spread of dogma. Our desire for some future prevalence of a reasonable and logical worldview must drive us to seek new methods for dispelling the myths and articulating the shortcomings of religious faith.  We cannot simply cry ‘bullshit’ in our solitude and be done with it.  We must exploit whatever media are at our disposal.  We must maximize our unity of purpose and refute religious zeal with equal passion.  We must continue to further our own media, question our obligation to endure the verbalization by the faithful and offer alternatives to the unsubstantiated platitudes of Christianity and all religions.

(Andrew):  Whew!

 
 
TheBrotherMario
 
Avatar
 
 
TheBrotherMario
Total Posts:  4488
Joined  02-04-2011
 
 
 
21 May 2012 19:15
 

I wonder if this guy knows that he just spread a bunch of atheistic DOGMA?

Probably not.

 
 
eudemonia
 
Avatar
 
 
eudemonia
Total Posts:  9031
Joined  05-04-2008
 
 
 
21 May 2012 19:44
 

Prayer studies have shown that it works no more often than not praying.

It’s bogus confirmation bias like all things of faith.

 
 
 1 2 >