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Why Is It Important To Convince Others That There Is No God?

 
Persuading Others for Eternity
 
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Persuading Others for Eternity
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01 September 2014 23:08
 

As I read various blogs and posts, I find it interesting that unbelievers are just as evangelical in their approach as believers. If a person who does not believe in God sees merit in convincing others that their belief is misguided or misplaced at best, why do they give believers such a difficult time about their evangelizing as they are motivated to share their belief in a loving, holy, and just God?

 
GAD
 
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GAD
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01 September 2014 23:37
 
Persuading Others for Eternity - 01 September 2014 09:08 PM

As I read various blogs and posts, I find it interesting that unbelievers are just as evangelical in their approach as believers. If a person who does not believe in God sees merit in convincing others that their belief is misguided or misplaced at best, why do they give believers such a difficult time about their evangelizing as they are motivated to share their belief in a loving, holy, and just God?

The fact that you have to ask the question implies you don’t have the mental capacity to understand any answer.

 
 
Persuading Others for Eternity
 
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Persuading Others for Eternity
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02 September 2014 00:03
 

Thoughtful responses are appreciated more than attacks on one’s mental capacity.

[ Edited: 02 September 2014 00:10 by Persuading Others for Eternity]
 
Persuading Others for Eternity
 
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Persuading Others for Eternity
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02 September 2014 00:09
 
GAD - 01 September 2014 09:37 PM
Persuading Others for Eternity - 01 September 2014 09:08 PM

As I read various blogs and posts, I find it interesting that unbelievers are just as evangelical in their approach as believers. If a person who does not believe in God sees merit in convincing others that their belief is misguided or misplaced at best, why do they give believers such a difficult time about their evangelizing as they are motivated to share their belief in a loving, holy, and just God?

The fact that you have to ask the question implies you don’t have the mental capacity to understand any answer.

Your response infers that you have low self-esteem or you lack being reared by good parents. Possibly both.

 
saralynn
 
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saralynn
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02 September 2014 00:12
 
GAD - 01 September 2014 09:37 PM
Persuading Others for Eternity - 01 September 2014 09:08 PM

As I read various blogs and posts, I find it interesting that unbelievers are just as evangelical in their approach as believers. If a person who does not believe in God sees merit in convincing others that their belief is misguided or misplaced at best, why do they give believers such a difficult time about their evangelizing as they are motivated to share their belief in a loving, holy, and just God?

The fact that you have to ask the question implies you don’t have the mental capacity to understand any answer.


Because, now and throughout recorded history, people who claim to worship a loving, holy and just God do so many unloving, unholy and unjust deeds. 

Ignore GAD; every Forum has a meanie and he is ours.  We also have a theist meanie, so it all balances out.

That being said, your name is a bit goofy.  You won’t find many atheists who are against eternity. Unless you mean the length of time in which you intend to persuade others….if that is the case, you will have to inform us of that you wish to persuade us.

If “eternity” is a code word for “Heaven”, then, unless you like “spirited” debate, I recommend you leave the premises because I am fairly sure you will be ridiculed.  I don’t say this with ill-will.  I just feel protective of newbies, especially those who choose such hopeful screen names as you did.

 
GAD
 
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02 September 2014 00:19
 
Persuading Others for Eternity - 01 September 2014 10:03 PM

Your response attempts to attack my mental capacity which is evidence of your low self-esteem or lack of being raised by good parents.

No, it just means that we are not friends or lovers so there is no reason to coddle you and not to call bullshit on bullshit. Religion has brought nothing but a sadomasochistic worship of ignorance, myth, magic and superstition to the world, but as people get their heads chopped off or buried alive for god you don’t get why atheists would care. Please…..

 
 
Gregoryhhh
 
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02 September 2014 00:54
 
Persuading Others for Eternity - 01 September 2014 09:08 PM

As I read various blogs and posts, I find it interesting that unbelievers are just as evangelical in their approach as believers. If a person who does not believe in God sees merit in convincing others that their belief is misguided or misplaced at best, why do they give believers such a difficult time about their evangelizing as they are motivated to share their belief in a loving, holy, and just God?

Would be more accurate or perhaps more mannerly, to use a qualifier or quantifier in front of the word “unbelievers” in your second sentence?

Perhaps something like “i find it interesting that some unbelievers, or most unbelievers, or a few too many unbelievers, are just as evangelical . . .

To answer your question about why unbelievers give believers such a difficult time - i’d say it’s just personality - some do, some dont.

I was an enthusiastic Christian evangelist who would talk to anybody anytime and even used to proselytize at Bart stations for gawds sake! But I dont find myself evangelizing others now as a post-christian, and i dont mind or give a difficult time to an evangelizing Christian. Frankly, It took me a few years as a post-christian before i would engage any Christian verbally about their “God” or any God, gods, or as i like to say “gawd.”

I don’t call myself an atheist though Christians call me an unbeliever. I haven’t heard of any definition of “god “ worth repeating, certainly not the Abramic one. For me, for now, gawd is defined using the same word that is used as a correct answer in mathematics – UNDEFINED. - See more at: http://www.project-reason.org/forum/viewthread/29081/P0/#sthash.hMeW7gjD.dpuf


Post Scriptum: As one newbie to another, Welcome to PR.

 
 
SkepticX
 
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02 September 2014 01:36
 
saralynn - 01 September 2014 10:12 PM

Ignore GAD; every Forum has a meanie and he is ours.  We also have a theist meanie, so it all balances out.


GAD’s our consistent reminder that dogmatists/fundamentalist types come in pretty much all world views.

 
 
GAD
 
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02 September 2014 01:43
 
SkepticX - 01 September 2014 11:36 PM
saralynn - 01 September 2014 10:12 PM

Ignore GAD; every Forum has a meanie and he is ours.  We also have a theist meanie, so it all balances out.


GAD’s our consistent reminder that dogmatists/fundamentalist types come in pretty much all world views.

And you are our reminder that self-righteous, condescending, pretentious bores are also pricks.

 
 
Gila Guerilla
 
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Gila Guerilla
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02 September 2014 01:44
 
Persuading Others for Eternity - 01 September 2014 09:08 PM

As I read various blogs and posts, I find it interesting that unbelievers are just as evangelical in their approach as believers. If a person who does not believe in God sees merit in convincing others that their belief is misguided or misplaced at best, why do they give believers such a difficult time about their evangelizing as they are motivated to share their belief in a loving, holy, and just God?

My reply would be that when one makes a positive claim, then if there is to be any proving done, the burden is on the person(s) making the positive claim. If a belief is taken on faith, then that faith is an admission of insufficient evidence for proof. In that light then, the loving, holy and just god is indistinguishable from a fantasy ; a made-up thing.

When the god is as good as a fantasised, made-up thing, then it should not be used to impose conduct, rules etc. onto those who do not believe in it. For those who fail to find the sufficient evidence, then the best position is one of agnostic atheism. Any attempts by believers to impose upon others, by preaching or legislation, should thus be exposed by those who don’t accept it, as based on hollow grounds . Religions are capable of promoting some very immoral behaviours, and are not free from responsibility in influencing some people to indulge in bad behaviour in this world, (think George W. Bush Jnr. and Iraq or more currently Northern Iraq/Syria and I.S.)

This does not absolve atheists from having been, and being responsible for some atrocious acts. The facts either way do nothing to establish the truth of any god. However, the facts do show that religions are capable of producing bad behaviour, which is what one would expect. People are people, but supposed gods can be used to legitimise much that is not desirable by many wise peoples’ standards.

And why should non-believers be silent? After all, don’t believers view us as sinners, and earmarked for hell? Not believing can be a very serious choice, ie. not settled upon lightly, and being sentenced to hell, or at least labelled less than moral for a judicious attempt to be true, is not nice. Religions also promote ideas which are deemed to be shown to be false, and I for one have a strong desire for truth, (hence my non-belief). I say: “don’t believe something if you have no good reason, (based on indisputable evidence), to believe that it is true”.

Many religionists claim that evolution for example is false. Yet science has determined that it is true, based on good evidence. Thus creationism is false. This means that the biblical accounts of how life came to be, are ridiculous. Yet religionists seek to have evolution as a valid explanation crushed, or at least a non-scientific religious version of things imposed onto education systems. So we who don’t buy into the fantasy, made-up aspects of religion should oppose them.

Let people think for themselves, and not be told how to think or behave. You can be free to believe, and others can be free to not believe, but we need to not impose on others. In the evolution case, for example, creationism is non-scientific. It can be taught as an aspect of a comparative religions course, or taught in a religious school as part of the religion.. Freedom is thus maintained. Since creationism is non-scientific, it should not be imposed on schools to include it in a science course.

Should you wish to oppose abortion and euthanasia, then follow your beliefs and don’t partake of them. But don’t impose on others your views. If others do things with which you do not agree, let it be. You do not have to follow suit. Yet people try to impose into legislation things based on their apparently fantasy, made-up god. It should be permissible for non-believers to oppose religious impositions, and that is relevant to the state of play, to which you refer, Persuading Others for Eternity, I presume.

If you want to make arguments in favour of the existence of your god, go ahead, but don’t be surprised if most of us have heard it all before, found it lacking, and thus a frustrating waste of board space. If you have any new slants, then that would be interesting, but they had better be well founded, if you don’t want to find yourself on the same merry-go-round you may have experienced elsewhere.

[ Edited: 02 September 2014 01:48 by Gila Guerilla]
 
 
GAD
 
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02 September 2014 02:23
 
Gila Guerilla - 01 September 2014 11:44 PM

If you want to make arguments in favour of the existence of your god, go ahead, but don’t be surprised if most of us have heard it all before, found it lacking, and thus a frustrating waste of board space. If you have any new slants, then that would be interesting, but they had better be well founded, if you don’t want to find yourself on the same merry-go-round you may have experienced elsewhere.

A very nice reply but I fear it is wasted. It’s possible that POEternity is completely clueless here but my bet is that they already have the answer they want and this is just bait for their agenda.

 
 
Brick Bungalow
 
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02 September 2014 02:54
 
Persuading Others for Eternity - 01 September 2014 09:08 PM

As I read various blogs and posts, I find it interesting that unbelievers are just as evangelical in their approach as believers. If a person who does not believe in God sees merit in convincing others that their belief is misguided or misplaced at best, why do they give believers such a difficult time about their evangelizing as they are motivated to share their belief in a loving, holy, and just God?


It’s not. I don’t care to persuade anyone in such regards. But I do want to defeat religious privilege and religious authority. I want all ideas and worldviews to b enjoy equal protection. I want propositions to be judged on merit and evidence rather than popularity or resilience.I want to live in a society where laws and social contracts are based on rational compassion and inclusion rather than on peculiar ancient writings from halfway around the world.

People who are educated, curious and emotionally honest will tend to ditch religion by themselves. The best thing I can do to help is to advocate for schools, libraries and public parks. I’m confident that secularism follows naturally once you create a safe space for people to find it on their own.

[ Edited: 02 September 2014 02:56 by Brick Bungalow]
 
Gregoryhhh
 
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02 September 2014 03:08
 

Why Is It Important To Convince Others That There Is No God? - See more at: http://www.project-reason.org/forum/viewthread/29084/#sthash.34kY2kN7.dpuf

Um, it’s not important to convince others that there is no “God” - Though it may be a benefit to they who believe in the Abramic one to discover that that one doesn’t exist. I as an example, spent 20 some years of my life embracing the delusion of a “God” (the Abramic one ) that didn’t and doesn’t exist.Nowadays i have a one word definition of gawd:  UNDEFINED

 
 
SteveMcKerracher
 
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02 September 2014 04:53
 
Persuading Others for Eternity - 01 September 2014 09:08 PM

As I read various blogs and posts, I find it interesting that unbelievers are just as evangelical in their approach as believers. If a person who does not believe in God sees merit in convincing others that their belief is misguided or misplaced at best, why do they give believers such a difficult time about their evangelizing as they are motivated to share their belief in a loving, holy, and just God?

Honestly, I don’t think “Theism Vs Atheism” is an important debate.

The important debate, is Faith vs Reason.  You cannot reason with, negotiate with, or compromise with faith.  Faith is the absolute best way of controlling, and exploiting people, and the best way to justify atrocity.

This makes this Faith vs Reason culture war the most critical part of our age, if humanity is to endure.  And it should be clear, Theism tends to be on the side of faith, while Reason is on the side of Atheism. 

But that is merely a sidebar to the culture war that really matters.

If a person wishes to choose to believe in a god, based on faith, but accepts the fact that there is no reason to expect anyone else to come to the same conclusion, and is willing to change parts of their belief that do contradict sound reasoning and evidence, I couldn’t care less. 

Personal beliefs don’t have a burden of proof, whereas public claims necessarily do.

 
 
SkepticX
 
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02 September 2014 11:19
 
SteveMcKerracher - 02 September 2014 02:53 AM
Persuading Others for Eternity - 01 September 2014 09:08 PM

As I read various blogs and posts, I find it interesting that unbelievers are just as evangelical in their approach as believers. If a person who does not believe in God sees merit in convincing others that their belief is misguided or misplaced at best, why do they give believers such a difficult time about their evangelizing as they are motivated to share their belief in a loving, holy, and just God?

Honestly, I don’t think “Theism Vs Atheism” is an important debate.

The important debate, is Faith vs Reason.  You cannot reason with, negotiate with, or compromise with faith.  Faith is the absolute best way of controlling, and exploiting people, and the best way to justify atrocity.

This makes this Faith vs Reason culture war the most critical part of our age, if humanity is to endure.  And it should be clear, Theism tends to be on the side of faith, while Reason is on the side of Atheism.

But that is merely a sidebar to the culture war that really matters.

If a person wishes to choose to believe in a god, based on faith, but accepts the fact that there is no reason to expect anyone else to come to the same conclusion, and is willing to change parts of their belief that do contradict sound reasoning and evidence, I couldn’t care less. 

Personal beliefs don’t have a burden of proof, whereas public claims necessarily do.


Nice!

I’d go one simpler though. I don’t even really care if Believer X thinks others should accept his beliefs and doesn’t apply any kind of remotely reasonable standard of error/completely compartmentalizes them, as long as Believer X is a good neighbor—doesn’t want to impose her beliefs on others, and Believer X’s standard issue cooperative human nature hasn’t been too compromised by dogma (if it’s been enhanced/exaggerated ... all the better, though I might be concerned with that on Believer X’s behalf because that could be unhealthy for Believer X, depending).

 
 
Jefe
 
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02 September 2014 14:19
 
Persuading Others for Eternity - 01 September 2014 09:08 PM

.. why do they give believers such a difficult time about their evangelizing

Do they?

I can’t speak for anyone else, but I don’t.
I do recognize it when I see it, though.

 
 
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