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John Oliver sets up his own church

 
GAD
 
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GAD
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17 August 2015 15:19
 
 
 
Skipshot
 
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Skipshot
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18 August 2015 03:35
 

After many years disavowing religion and spewing such on this forum, it still amazes me that there are people out there who still fall for this.

 
GAD
 
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GAD
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18 August 2015 05:43
 
Skipshot - 18 August 2015 01:35 AM

After many years disavowing religion and spewing such on this forum, it still amazes me that there are people out there who still fall for this.

Amen on that. but I’m sure the theists can justify it one way or another.

 
 
SkepticX
 
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18 August 2015 12:01
 
Skipshot - 18 August 2015 01:35 AM

After many years disavowing religion and spewing such on this forum, it still amazes me that there are people out there who still fall for this.


A related notion interrupted my meditation this morning ... imposed its reality upon my experience by the shear force of its intimacy, having fully drilled through my skull and found purchase. It was a flash of depth—not anyhing new.

It takes a great deal to truly change one’s perceptions to a significant degree—to alter the way we perceive—the words and ideas that occur in response to stimuli. You can jettison your doctrinal religious beliefs because you see through them, but you’ll have to work a lot harder, or wait a good while (let it sneak up on you over the years), before you can remove the perceptual filter they’ve established over your senses and your mind. Until then you’ll just have to recognize it and compensate. You can even internalize that process so it’s second nature, but you’re still seeing through the filter.

All that to maybe explain just how hard it really is, and unlikely, for any individual to get free and clear of The Matrix ... any matrix. Most aren’t even inclined to reflect on such things, and why should they if things are going fine for them and they’re not contemplative or introspective types? Another thing I’ve noticed along these lines is that very few seem to really go there—to really put their own perceptions and ideations under a microscope, even when they do those of others. I think we’re all handicapped in that sense—very hard to use machinery to examine the machinery itself—but it also seems most are just categorically blind to all of this. And ultimately maybe it’s like trying to directly view your own eyes.

Something else that comes out of this is the innateness of relativism—we’re considering the relative smarts of some of the other smartest beasties in our experience of the Cosmos—makes me think maybe we’re about an inch ahead on a journey of miles in a given metric.

 
 
Jefe
 
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Jefe
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18 August 2015 13:16
 
SkepticX - 18 August 2015 10:01 AM
Skipshot - 18 August 2015 01:35 AM

After many years disavowing religion and spewing such on this forum, it still amazes me that there are people out there who still fall for this.

Something else that comes out of this is the innateness of relativism—we’re considering the relative smarts of some of the other smartest beasties in our experience of the Cosmos—makes me think maybe we’re about an inch ahead on a journey of miles in a given metric.

Several metrics, IMHO.
We’re not as clever as we think we are. (Or paint ourselves to be…)

 
 
Skipshot
 
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Skipshot
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18 August 2015 14:58
 
Jefe - 18 August 2015 11:16 AM
SkepticX - 18 August 2015 10:01 AM
Skipshot - 18 August 2015 01:35 AM

After many years disavowing religion and spewing such on this forum, it still amazes me that there are people out there who still fall for this.

Something else that comes out of this is the innateness of relativism—we’re considering the relative smarts of some of the other smartest beasties in our experience of the Cosmos—makes me think maybe we’re about an inch ahead on a journey of miles in a given metric.

Several metrics, IMHO.
We’re not as clever as we think we are. (Or paint ourselves to be…)

This reminds me of the old joke about two friends hiking in the woods and encountered an angry bear.  As one of the friends started to change from his hiking boots to running shoes the other friend remarked, “You won’t be able to outrun the bear.”  Responded the other friend, “Nope.  I just need to outrun you.”

Preacher-predators don’t need to learn the ways of the cosmos to be considered smart or clever, they need only be smarter than the hopeful fools who give them money.

 
Jefe
 
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Jefe
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18 August 2015 16:58
 
Skipshot - 18 August 2015 12:58 PM
Jefe - 18 August 2015 11:16 AM
SkepticX - 18 August 2015 10:01 AM
Skipshot - 18 August 2015 01:35 AM

After many years disavowing religion and spewing such on this forum, it still amazes me that there are people out there who still fall for this.

Something else that comes out of this is the innateness of relativism—we’re considering the relative smarts of some of the other smartest beasties in our experience of the Cosmos—makes me think maybe we’re about an inch ahead on a journey of miles in a given metric.

Several metrics, IMHO.
We’re not as clever as we think we are. (Or paint ourselves to be…)

This reminds me of the old joke about two friends hiking in the woods and encountered an angry bear.  As one of the friends started to change from his hiking boots to running shoes the other friend remarked, “You won’t be able to outrun the bear.”  Responded the other friend, “Nope.  I just need to outrun you.”

Preacher-predators don’t need to learn the ways of the cosmos to be considered smart or clever, they need only be smarter than the hopeful fools who give them money.

Or charismatic enough to dampen their victim’s bull-shit detection.

 
 
EN
 
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EN
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18 August 2015 23:26
 

What these snake oil salesmen sell is hope - hope that there is someone who is going to bless me, watch over me, etc.  They’ve just learned to profit from it.  They are entrepreneurs, capitalists.  They should be regulated, like anyone else selling stuff.  They are asking for money for X. 

The other day a hospital got fined because its floral license had expired and it sold a floral arrangement from its gift shop to somebody.  $250 fine for selling flowers without a license.  If selling flowers needs to be regulated, selling false hope should be regulated more.

 
GAD
 
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GAD
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18 August 2015 23:36
 
EN - 18 August 2015 09:26 PM

What these snake oil salesmen sell is hope - hope that there is someone who is going to bless me, watch over me, etc.  They’ve just learned to profit from it.  They are entrepreneurs, capitalists.  They should be regulated, like anyone else selling stuff.  They are asking for money for X. 

The other day a hospital got fined because its floral license had expired and it sold a floral arrangement from its gift shop to somebody.  $250 fine for selling flowers without a license.  If selling flowers needs to be regulated, selling false hope should be regulated more.

That means regulating religion because that is what religion is, false hope.

 
 
Celal
 
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Celal
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18 August 2015 23:54
 
GAD - 18 August 2015 09:36 PM
EN - 18 August 2015 09:26 PM

What these snake oil salesmen sell is hope - hope that there is someone who is going to bless me, watch over me, etc.  They’ve just learned to profit from it.  They are entrepreneurs, capitalists.  They should be regulated, like anyone else selling stuff.  They are asking for money for X. 

The other day a hospital got fined because its floral license had expired and it sold a floral arrangement from its gift shop to somebody.  $250 fine for selling flowers without a license.  If selling flowers needs to be regulated, selling false hope should be regulated more.

That means regulating religion because that is what religion is, false hope.

This is what I was thinking while watching the John Oliver Video. Should take it all the way to Supreme Court to make his point, if he is challenged as a legitimate church.  Hence, it might lead to some good.

 
GAD
 
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GAD
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19 August 2015 00:15
 
Celal - 18 August 2015 09:54 PM
GAD - 18 August 2015 09:36 PM
EN - 18 August 2015 09:26 PM

What these snake oil salesmen sell is hope - hope that there is someone who is going to bless me, watch over me, etc.  They’ve just learned to profit from it.  They are entrepreneurs, capitalists.  They should be regulated, like anyone else selling stuff.  They are asking for money for X. 

The other day a hospital got fined because its floral license had expired and it sold a floral arrangement from its gift shop to somebody.  $250 fine for selling flowers without a license.  If selling flowers needs to be regulated, selling false hope should be regulated more.

That means regulating religion because that is what religion is, false hope.

This is what I was thinking while watching the John Oliver Video. Should take it all the way to Supreme Court to make his point, if he is challenged as a legitimate church.  Hence, it might lead to some good.

Like to make medical claims they have to get FDA approval.

 
 
EN
 
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EN
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19 August 2015 00:19
 

Religion that does not charge anything needs no regulation.  When I preached I took no pay.  There is religion that is not false hope.  I know you don’t agree.

 
GAD
 
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GAD
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19 August 2015 00:31
 
EN - 18 August 2015 10:19 PM

Religion that does not charge anything needs no regulation.  When I preached I took no pay.  There is religion that is not false hope.  I know you don’t agree.

Yes I see believing that make believe gods care about you and will grant you wishes if you sacrifice and suffer enough as false hope.

 
 
Skipshot
 
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19 August 2015 00:38
 

GAD, EN has admitted that his experience here has cleared up much of the confusions and contradictions in his faith and caused him to re-evaluate.  Much of the time he is on the infidel’s side, such as now, so how about giving him some slack?

 
Skipshot
 
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19 August 2015 00:51
 

Celal, this should be an interesting case: Indiana’s Church of Cannabis files religious liberty suit

NDIANAPOLIS —The First Church of Cannabis filed a lawsuit Wednesday against the state of Indiana and city of Indianapolis, challenging state laws on possession and use of marijuana as infringing upon religious beliefs.

. . .

Under the state’s new Religious Freedom Restoration Act, which took effect July 1, the government must prove it is enforcing a compelling interest in the least restrictive way if a person claims an undue burden on religious liberty. The Church of Cannabis had its first service July 1 but said its members would not use cannabis after law enforcement warned that police would arrest anyone who smoked pot.

Edit:  This case will test Indiana’s governor’s claim that the Indiana law is the same as the federal law which was put in place to protect Native Americans who use peyote as a sacrament.

[ Edited: 19 August 2015 00:53 by Skipshot]
 
Celal
 
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19 August 2015 03:20
 

Skip, indeed fascinating! “...Indiana’s governor’s claim that the Indiana law is the same as the federal law”

If so, the complaint should have some protection under the federal law as the cannabis is claimed to be the church’s sacrament and its members believe marijuana brings them closer to themselves and others. Who is to argue otherwise? Who is to say the religion of church of cannabis any less authentic than the charlatans’ in the OP video? I sure love to hear the “for/against” arguments in the court of law where everyone is treated equally.

 
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