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Jordan Peterson 2.0

 
diding
 
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diding
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15 March 2017 13:52
 

I think Sam gave Jordan allot to think about.  I wish Jordan would have answered Sam’s question about “Why identify as a Christian?”  I would really have liked to have heard Jordan’s answer.  What make Christianity so important to him?  I wonder if he believes in Heaven or an afterlife.

 
LauraG
 
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LauraG
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15 March 2017 18:10
 

I truly enjoyed (& personally benefited from, intellectually, that is), this podcast. I listened to it yesterday. I, too, would like to know why Jordan chooses to “hang his hat on” Christianity specifically. To me, it shoots down everything else he says.

Sam, as always, in my view, proves himself to be the far superior intellectual & philosophical (and dare I say - common sense) warrior against his foes.

 
LauraG
 
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LauraG
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15 March 2017 20:58
 

Based on both podcasts Sam v Jordan….I don’t understand what Jordan’s followers find appealing about him.

[ Edited: 16 March 2017 08:24 by LauraG]
 
FerdRoseboom
 
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FerdRoseboom
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16 March 2017 08:55
 
diding - 15 March 2017 01:52 PM

I wish Jordan would have answered Sam’s question about “Why identify as a Christian?”  I would really have liked to have heard Jordan’s answer.  What make Christianity so important to him?

I’ve only started listening to it, but could it be inextricably linked to his belief in free will?  Note how he conceives of the origin or purpose of (religious) narrative as a declaration of social ‘ought’, not ‘is’.  The most insightful comment I readmfollowing the first podcast was one chahld made:  “The whole discussion revolved around Hume’s law (the is-ought problem).”

 
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diding
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17 March 2017 05:45
 
LauraG - 15 March 2017 08:58 PM

Based on both podcasts Sam v Jordan….I don’t understand what Jordan’s followers find appealing about him.

When Peterson talks about free speech and the Regressive Left’s connection to dangerous Marxism his thoughts are dead on.  He is flawlessly rational and internally consistent.  When he speaks it seems like he’s letting you directly into his thought process.  I get a sense of his struggle to answer the questions he addresses, unlike Sam who presents his ideas and opinions fully formed and well packaged. 

On the issue of Christianity I don’t know exactly where he stands.  If he sees the Bible as a purely mythological work which contains some useful ideas about morality then I’m with him.  I can understand that. If he thinks that God is a guy in the sky and that Jesus was actually resurrected then I would have to say that on those particular issues he is mistaken.  I get a feeling that he doesn’t want to say what he really thinks about God and Jesus because he knows that his basis of his beliefs is fragile.

 
Twissel
 
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Twissel
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17 March 2017 07:15
 

Less confrontational but not really much more incisive than the last one.

I like Peterson’s point about sacrifice being an investment into the future. But I think he approaches the idea from the wrong angle:
sharing your surplus with others in a group in expectation of receiving from them in the future is basic in most animals forming social groups.
It is only a small step from there to looking for other recipients of your largess: from leaving bits of food for animals it is just a small step to sacrificing to a spirit.
But anything given freely more than three times in a row becomes a habit and then an obligation: giving for a favour will turn into paying to prevent harm.

 
 
Azirahael
 
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Azirahael
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13 June 2017 20:21
 

I have no facts, only opinions.
And, i am a total JP fan.

However, i find it suspicious that JP is so clear, so incisive, and almost revelatory in his speech on every subject, except his religious belief.

He is absolutely clear. No bullshit.
On every other topic.

but as soon as he gets asked ‘do you believe in god?’ he starts talking about logos and such.
He also appears to believe that if a person brings themselves into alignment (whatever that means) that they might be able to resurrect themselves from the dead.

Nothing concrete, but i suspect very strongly that he has some irrational beliefs.
which reduces him in my eyes.

 
Nhoj Morley
 
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13 June 2017 22:35
 
Azirahael - 13 June 2017 08:21 PM

  i am a total JP fan.

We have heard that there are people like yourself out there. Perhaps you can help us with this JP stuff.

Could you pick out one or two examples of the best of JP as you see it? What might impress an audience who has only heard his full retreat on Sam’s podcast?

 
 
Azirahael
 
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Azirahael
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13 June 2017 22:39
 
Nhoj Morley - 13 June 2017 10:35 PM
Azirahael - 13 June 2017 08:21 PM

  i am a total JP fan.

We have heard that there are people like yourself out there. Perhaps you can help us with this JP stuff.

Could you pick out one or two examples of the best of JP as you see it? What might impress an audience who has only heard his full retreat on Sam’s podcast?

Sure. Keep in mind, his cutting edge is psychology, specifically business and social psych.
He has a lot of good stuff to say about life, people and society.

did you have a theme?
I mean, there’s 500+ hours of his stuff online.
Look on YT.

Tell me what you want, and i’ll get it for you.

Failing that, i can find a bit that speaks to me, and explain it to you.
But, i have a psych background, so i get what he’s saying.

 

 
Nhoj Morley
 
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13 June 2017 22:46
 

no theme in particular. Psych is fine.
Newbie’s choice…

 
 
Azirahael
 
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Azirahael
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13 June 2017 23:39
 

Here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CLg6e0o0rPw

Dunno about ‘best’ but it’s pretty damn good.
It’s all about understanding that oppressor and oppressed are a lot closer than we think.
He copvers a number of topics in any talk, but they are often good for ‘fix your life.’

Wanna feel better about yourself? Make someone’s life better. Lift something heavy. Then at least you can point to that and say, ‘well, at least i did that.’

He’s got his own channel, but they are usually 1hr lectures, or longer.

I’m gonna go clean my room.

JP fans will get the joke. raspberry

[ Edited: 13 June 2017 23:43 by Azirahael]
 
Azirahael
 
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Azirahael
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14 June 2017 03:27
 

Actually, i’d like to hear from Sam, what he thinks about Jordan’s stance on ‘Is there a god.’

He may well have a better idea, given that he’s spoken to JP more than once.

 
Nhoj Morley
 
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Nhoj Morley
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14 June 2017 07:18
 

Thanks.

Posting here does not address questions to Sam. I suggest trying his “Ask Me Anything’ link and leaving your question there. It is ‘AMA’ on the navi bar.

 
 
Azirahael
 
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Azirahael
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15 June 2017 21:58
 

Any feedback on the JP link i provided?

 
Nhoj Morley
 
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Nhoj Morley
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15 June 2017 22:34
 

Patience… So many daily horrors to sift through. JP is not one of them but-

I tried that clip and a few other morsels. Then I really wanted to stop. His method starts to show. He quotes a famous wiseguy and moves on as if it connects to his words in some way. It is folksy and fatherly advice served up in a professorial shell game that counts on the listener not keeping up with the razzle-dazzle of quotes and Great Glorious Names. He is good at framing things in metaphysical contexts. What for? Shouldn’t we be developing better ways to frame things than metaphysically?

Principle Peterson seems like an example of the Peter Principle.

 
 
Brick Bungalow
 
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Brick Bungalow
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19 June 2017 22:01
 

I like Petersen for his charisma and his courage even though I rarely agree with his positions. It’s sad that he’s become an impromptu touch stone for some alt right types. I think he’s better than that.

I’m a little uncomfortable with the earnestness of some of his assertions. He seems to weigh in on a lot of issues that lie outside his particular credentials. I think it would be more professional to qualify this a bit more carefully. That’s a long winded way of saying that I find him pretty dogmatic which is unfortunate given that he persistently criticizes dogmatism on the part of his ideological opponents.

All-in-all I do like the guy and think his contributions are worthy. He’s strident and peculiar but he strikes me as honest.

 
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