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What is Religion?

 
Kalessin
 
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Kalessin
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17 September 2017 16:33
 
MrRon - 17 September 2017 05:46 AM

Here’s another BIG REVEAL.
Ron

Okay, I genuinely laughed.  You probably deserve to know I’m not religious and am skeptical about everything smile.

And now ... Shaikh

“The BIG REVEAL is SCIENCE OF CONSCIOUSNESS
And freedom from anthropocentric worldview
And finally becoming of the world OBVIOUS before eyes without “interpretation"and its errors. Only truth will be believed
The source of our getting cheated/misguided lies within us on that we trust fully ie the human mind.
Human mind is artificial. It is a “social-implant” into our body like a software is a human implant into a computer”

Okay I read the LinkedIn post, which is MUCH clearer than all your posts on this forum have been.  Not 100% clear, but much clearer smile.

I think I can just about embrace your hypothesis in general terms although your foundational syllogisms need to be tested and I don’t think you have resolved hard solipsism regardless of your premise.  But I am interested actually to know where this position takes you (or us).  What is the next step?  A re-invention of language and re-wiring of cognition?  Or - what is the truth we will come to know when we are liberated from dualism as you describe it? 

Kalessin

 
Ground
 
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Ground
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18 September 2017 00:59
 
Shaikh Raisuddin - 23 August 2017 08:44 AM

Can anyone give a near precise definition of religion which can represent all types of religion primitive to present, from theist to atheist (Buddhism)?

Religions are systems of thought that are trying to establish meaning in teleological and teleonomical meaninglessness.

 
Shaikh Raisuddin
 
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Shaikh Raisuddin
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18 September 2017 09:51
 
Kalessin - 17 September 2017 04:33 PM
MrRon - 17 September 2017 05:46 AM

Here’s another BIG REVEAL.
Ron

Okay, I genuinely laughed.  You probably deserve to know I’m not religious and am skeptical about everything smile.

And now ... Shaikh

“The BIG REVEAL is SCIENCE OF CONSCIOUSNESS
And freedom from anthropocentric worldview
And finally becoming of the world OBVIOUS before eyes without “interpretation"and its errors. Only truth will be believed
The source of our getting cheated/misguided lies within us on that we trust fully ie the human mind.
Human mind is artificial. It is a “social-implant” into our body like a software is a human implant into a computer”

Okay I read the LinkedIn post, which is MUCH clearer than all your posts on this forum have been.  Not 100% clear, but much clearer smile.

I think I can just about embrace your hypothesis in general terms although your foundational syllogisms need to be tested and I don’t think you have resolved hard solipsism regardless of your premise.  But I am interested actually to know where this position takes you (or us).  What is the next step?  A re-invention of language and re-wiring of cognition?  Or - what is the truth we will come to know when we are liberated from dualism as you describe it? 

Kalessin

The next position takes us to relate man and matter.
Development in speech recognition technology, bionic-implants have paved the ways to develop a TRANSLATOR between alphabetical languages and LANGUAGE OF MATTER
This will also help in design and communication with AI.
It will give SUPER SCIENCE or God’s Science.

BTW, How do you define language?

 

 
Kalessin
 
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Kalessin
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19 September 2017 16:40
 
Shaikh Raisuddin - 18 September 2017 09:51 AM

Development in speech recognition technology, bionic-implants have paved the ways to develop a TRANSLATOR between alphabetical languages and LANGUAGE OF MATTER
This will also help in design and communication with AI.
It will give SUPER SCIENCE or God’s Science.

This is a bit convoluted - you are talking about a kind of non-verbal, non-linguistic information exchange?  Freed from the mediations or limitations that language imposes on reallity?

OK.  There are a fair number of non-linguistic information pathways extant in human beings and other entities.  I am still wanting to know why this is better for us, and how we would actually experience it consciously.  If we didn’t experience it consciously, it would just happen without either perception or awareness, and we wouldn’t be better off (that’s how these pathways work now).

Then you mention “God’s Science” - I can’t see how that fits in or what it might mean.

Please stay focused and be precise.  I am working hard to genuinely understand the ideas smile.
Kalessin smile

 
Shaikh Raisuddin
 
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Shaikh Raisuddin
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20 September 2017 12:06
 
Kalessin - 19 September 2017 04:40 PM
Shaikh Raisuddin - 18 September 2017 09:51 AM

Development in speech recognition technology, bionic-implants have paved the ways to develop a TRANSLATOR between alphabetical languages and LANGUAGE OF MATTER
This will also help in design and communication with AI.
It will give SUPER SCIENCE or God’s Science.

This is a bit convoluted - you are talking about a kind of non-verbal, non-linguistic information exchange?  Freed from the mediations or limitations that language imposes on reallity?

OK.  There are a fair number of non-linguistic information pathways extant in human beings and other entities.  I am still wanting to know why this is better for us, and how we would actually experience it consciously.  If we didn’t experience it consciously, it would just happen without either perception or awareness, and we wouldn’t be better off (that’s how these pathways work now).

Then you mention “God’s Science” - I can’t see how that fits in or what it might mean.

Please stay focused and be precise.  I am working hard to genuinely understand the ideas smile.
Kalessin smile

When we see fire, it is obvious conscious information/experience even without word of fire. A prey has genetically programmed conscious awareness as to who is its predator without education or training. Humanity developed mind by neuro-linguistic programing to share and accumulate observation and experiences treasured as dictionary. Our reliance on dictionary became so dominant that we became addicted to misinterpretation which result into debate and conflict eg theism vs atheism and enormous others. Do we have any estimate of losses human society suffered due to misinterpretation of the very same beliefs it hold very dear strong to itself? While wisdom says, Prosperity, well-being and security of man do not lie in their possession but in living of that environment. Prosperity, well-being and security is an environment. Man cannot learn and cannot be enlightened by any education given in alphabetical language.Take the case of Sam Harris he is totally non believer in freewill yet he works against theism as if being theist is by an option of freewill. He is self-contradictory due to misinterpretation.

When a doctor sees an ECG he consciously become aware of the state of a heart.It will be with perception and awareness.

By Super Science or God’s Science means actual knowledge of how realities are created against the interpreted knowledge of how realities are constructed.

My ideas developed during my work of about 30 years (as hobby) on reality, viruses of mind (I call Opinion Virus) and finding an explanation of consciousness. 

 

 
MrRon
 
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21 September 2017 03:08
 
Shaikh Raisuddin - 20 September 2017 12:06 PM

My ideas developed during my work of about 30 years (as hobby) on reality, viruses of mind (I call Opinion Virus) and finding an explanation of consciousness. 

And “dictionary is the misery of mankind” is all you came up with??? Sorry to hear you wasted 30 years of your life.

Ron

 
Shaikh Raisuddin
 
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Shaikh Raisuddin
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21 September 2017 08:06
 
MrRon - 21 September 2017 03:08 AM
Shaikh Raisuddin - 20 September 2017 12:06 PM

My ideas developed during my work of about 30 years (as hobby) on reality, viruses of mind (I call Opinion Virus) and finding an explanation of consciousness. 

And “dictionary is the misery of mankind” is all you came up with??? Sorry to hear you wasted 30 years of your life.

Ron

You could not understand is the proof that dictionary is misery of mankind.

Do not jump to conclusion out of your ego.

I challenge to your self-claimed wisdom to solve mind-body problem if you can.

[ Edited: 21 September 2017 10:46 by Shaikh Raisuddin]
 
GAD
 
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21 September 2017 08:23
 
Shaikh Raisuddin - 21 September 2017 08:06 AM

You could not understand is the proof that dictionary is misery of mankind.


How could we understand, your words have no meaning, they are not scientific truth, they are your religion, and like all religions yours is complete bullshit.

 
 
Shaikh Raisuddin
 
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Shaikh Raisuddin
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21 September 2017 10:50
 
GAD - 21 September 2017 08:23 AM
Shaikh Raisuddin - 21 September 2017 08:06 AM

You could not understand is the proof that dictionary is misery of mankind.


How could we understand, your words have no meaning, they are not scientific truth, they are your religion, and like all religions yours is complete bullshit.

Can you tell:
How we mean what we mean?
How we believe what we believe?
How we observe what we observe?
How we know what we know?
Why we do what we do?

Or you are fanatic in using word bullshit?

 
Nhoj Morley
 
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Nhoj Morley
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21 September 2017 11:09
 
Shaikh Raisuddin - 21 September 2017 10:50 AM

Can you tell:
How we mean what we mean?
How we believe what we believe?
How we observe what we observe?
How we know what we know?
Why we do what we do?

Please choose any one of these questions and give your view about it. No one will engage what you say until we can get past how you say it. (look who’s talking) It is spooky and Halloween-like. “Dictionary is Misery” is the punchline, obviously. However, the set up is unclear.

 
 
Jan_CAN
 
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Jan_CAN
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21 September 2017 11:12
 

Cambridge English Dictionary

Fanatic (Definition):  a person who is extremely interested in something, to a degree that some people find unreasonable; a person who has very extreme beliefs that may lead them to behave in unreasonable or violent ways.

Bullshit (Definition):  complete nonsense or something that is not true.

Dictionary (Definition):  a book that contains a list of words in alphabetical order and that explains their meanings.


Communication is good.
Words are necessary for human communication.
Common understanding and usage of words is necessary for communication.
Dictionaries contain words and meanings that aid in common usage.
Therefore, dictionaries are good.
End of story.


[Edit:  Sorry Nhoj ... wouldn’t have posted this if I’d seen your post first.]

[ Edited: 21 September 2017 11:29 by Jan_CAN]
 
 
EN
 
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EN
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21 September 2017 12:04
 

This is an exercise in futility.

 
MrRon
 
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MrRon
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21 September 2017 17:35
 
Shaikh Raisuddin - 21 September 2017 08:06 AM
MrRon - 21 September 2017 03:08 AM
Shaikh Raisuddin - 20 September 2017 12:06 PM

My ideas developed during my work of about 30 years (as hobby) on reality, viruses of mind (I call Opinion Virus) and finding an explanation of consciousness. 

And “dictionary is the misery of mankind” is all you came up with??? Sorry to hear you wasted 30 years of your life.

Ron

You could not understand is the proof that dictionary is misery of mankind.

Again, do you think the world would have been a better place if there were never any dictionaries? How so? Would there not have been any wars, poverty, ignorance, bigotry, or disease? Please explain in what specific ways the world would be so much better if there were no dictionaries.

Do not jump to conclusion out of your ego.

I think we can all safely conclude that a:) dictionaries are NOT the misery of mankind, b) atheism (and science and the other things you mentioned) is NOT religion, and c) you sir, have wasted a precious 30 years of your life.

I challenge to your self-claimed wisdom to solve mind-body problem if you can.

Don’t know how you got here from dictionaries are misery and “atheism equals religion”, and I don’t know what you mean by “solve”, but here’s my take on it (assuming you’re referring to dualism?):

Minds are what brains do. No brains, no minds. Period.

Now that doesn’t mean there aren’t some open questions. There are. And consciousness may forever remain mysterious. Like your ramblings. It’s just the way it is.


Ron grin

 

 

 
Nhoj Morley
 
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Nhoj Morley
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21 September 2017 22:02
 
Jan_CAN - 21 September 2017 11:12 AM

[Edit:  Sorry Nhoj ... wouldn’t have posted this if I’d seen your post first.]

Please proceed. Hopefully, many hands will make the lights work.

Encouragement to be a better poster is never futile. Mostly.

 
 
uno
 
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uno
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22 September 2017 10:27
 
GAD - 24 August 2017 08:34 AM
Shaikh Raisuddin - 24 August 2017 08:29 AM

You define what is atheism. Is it just not believing in God?

And please define what belief is?

Atheism is knowing that make-believe gods are not real.

 

How or when does belief turn into knowledge? 

(I believe the difference between belief and knowledge is essentially a practical matter. The difference between proving something beyond any doubt and beyond a reasonable doubt is my guide.)

 
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