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If you think an ideology or religion is immoral and evil, should you actively oppose it?

 
jdrnd
 
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jdrnd
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07 October 2017 07:45
 
Greatest I am - 06 October 2017 05:07 PM
Brick Bungalow - 06 October 2017 04:30 PM

Sometimes I struggle to know whether your questions are serious.

Answer it and find out.

Regards
DL

Brick, myself and others are always suspicious when someone asks a question without also expressing their opinion of what they think the answer is.

I and others here do not want to play the role of Plato and his peers.  I for one do not wanted to play Socrates foil.
It is easier for you to comment on our opinions than to express your own.
So
Do you think that if an ideology or religion is immoral and evil, it should be actively opposed?

Respectfully Submitted
Jeff

 
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Skipshot
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07 October 2017 08:13
 
jdrnd - 07 October 2017 07:45 AM

Do you think that if an ideology or religion is immoral and evil, it should be actively opposed?

The opposite of love is apathy and ridicule.

 
jdrnd
 
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jdrnd
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07 October 2017 08:22
 
Skipshot - 07 October 2017 08:13 AM
jdrnd - 07 October 2017 07:45 AM

Do you think that if an ideology or religion is immoral and evil, it should be actively opposed?

The opposite of love is apathy and ridicule.


...not hate?

 
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Skipshot
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07 October 2017 08:27
 
jdrnd - 07 October 2017 08:22 AM
Skipshot - 07 October 2017 08:13 AM
jdrnd - 07 October 2017 07:45 AM

Do you think that if an ideology or religion is immoral and evil, it should be actively opposed?

The opposite of love is apathy and ridicule.


...not hate?

Hate fuels love.  Without fuel love dies.

 
Greatest I am
 
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Greatest I am
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07 October 2017 08:57
 
jdrnd - 07 October 2017 07:45 AM
Greatest I am - 06 October 2017 05:07 PM
Brick Bungalow - 06 October 2017 04:30 PM

Sometimes I struggle to know whether your questions are serious.

Answer it and find out.

Regards
DL

Brick, myself and others are always suspicious when someone asks a question without also expressing their opinion of what they think the answer is.

I and others here do not want to play the role of Plato and his peers.  I for one do not wanted to play Socrates foil.
It is easier for you to comment on our opinions than to express your own.
So
Do you think that if an ideology or religion is immoral and evil, it should be actively opposed?

Respectfully Submitted
Jeff

And here I thought that the site had just been infected with stupid people given the quality of the postings.

This is in the O.P. ” We have also called on all good people to actively oppose religions and ideologies that they feel are immoral and not deserving of their respect. ” ———and answers your question, so I guess you all are not stupid.

You just do not have reading comprehension.

Regards
DL

 
Greatest I am
 
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Greatest I am
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07 October 2017 08:59
 
Skipshot - 07 October 2017 08:13 AM
jdrnd - 07 October 2017 07:45 AM

Do you think that if an ideology or religion is immoral and evil, it should be actively opposed?

The opposite of love is apathy and ridicule.

That is not what the dictionary says and making up your own definition is not the best idea.

Do you know what a synonym and an antonym is?

Regards
DL

 
Greatest I am
 
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Greatest I am
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07 October 2017 09:05
 
Skipshot - 07 October 2017 08:27 AM
jdrnd - 07 October 2017 08:22 AM
Skipshot - 07 October 2017 08:13 AM
jdrnd - 07 October 2017 07:45 AM

Do you think that if an ideology or religion is immoral and evil, it should be actively opposed?

The opposite of love is apathy and ridicule.


...not hate?

Hate fuels love.  Without fuel love dies.

Actually, as humans, follow our selfish gene that promotes love and that is our default mental position. As we default to that love we, at the same time, create the opposite bias which is hate.

You have the right idea but have reversed our true process which is better for survival than your opposite one which is a lot worse for survival and that is why our selfish gene pushes love ahead of hate.

Cooperation is love and competition is hate. We prefer to cooperate as it is a better survival technique.

I have a link available that shows that love fuels hate if you do not get that simple truth I put above.

Regards
DL

 

[ Edited: 07 October 2017 09:08 by Greatest I am]
 
jdrnd
 
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jdrnd
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07 October 2017 09:11
 
Greatest I am - 07 October 2017 08:57 AM
jdrnd - 07 October 2017 07:45 AM
Greatest I am - 06 October 2017 05:07 PM
Brick Bungalow - 06 October 2017 04:30 PM

Sometimes I struggle to know whether your questions are serious.

Answer it and find out.

Regards
DL

Brick, myself and others are always suspicious when someone asks a question without also expressing their opinion of what they think the answer is.

I and others here do not want to play the role of Plato and his peers.  I for one do not wanted to play Socrates foil.
It is easier for you to comment on our opinions than to express your own.
So
Do you think that if an ideology or religion is immoral and evil, it should be actively opposed?

Respectfully Submitted
Jeff

And here I thought that the site had just been infected with stupid people given the quality of the postings.

This is in the O.P. ” We have also called on all good people to actively oppose religions and ideologies that they feel are immoral and not deserving of their respect. “

But this is a “loaded” question.

What a person is (good, bad, etc) varies with the ideology…
or does it?
what is your opinion?

you often answer with another question.

I don’t want to play “grasshopper”.

 

I’m off to hiking a mountain.
back tonight

 

 
Greatest I am
 
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Greatest I am
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07 October 2017 10:55
 
jdrnd - 07 October 2017 09:11 AM
Greatest I am - 07 October 2017 08:57 AM
jdrnd - 07 October 2017 07:45 AM
Greatest I am - 06 October 2017 05:07 PM
Brick Bungalow - 06 October 2017 04:30 PM

Sometimes I struggle to know whether your questions are serious.

Answer it and find out.

Regards
DL

Brick, myself and others are always suspicious when someone asks a question without also expressing their opinion of what they think the answer is.

I and others here do not want to play the role of Plato and his peers.  I for one do not wanted to play Socrates foil.
It is easier for you to comment on our opinions than to express your own.
So
Do you think that if an ideology or religion is immoral and evil, it should be actively opposed?

Respectfully Submitted
Jeff

And here I thought that the site had just been infected with stupid people given the quality of the postings.

This is in the O.P. ” We have also called on all good people to actively oppose religions and ideologies that they feel are immoral and not deserving of their respect. “

But this is a “loaded” question.

What a person is (good, bad, etc) varies with the ideology…
or does it?
what is your opinion?

you often answer with another question.

I don’t want to play “grasshopper”.

 

I’m off to hiking a mountain.
back tonight

Loaded question??

I did not answer with any question.

Nothing in my last has a question mark. If you meant the original question, everyone will have their own opinion as to it being loaded or not.

I do not see it as loaded.

“What a person is (good, bad, etc) varies with the ideology…
or does it?”

I think so, yes.

Regards
DL

 
Cheshire Cat
 
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Cheshire Cat
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07 October 2017 13:40
 

Greatest I am, I see that you are a Gnostic Christian which I find interesting. I’ve done a little reading about Gnostic Christianity, including Elaine Pagel’s “The Gnostic Gospels.”

In a nutshell, Gnostic Christians believe that the god that the Jews, Muslims, and other Christians worship, is a false, flawed and even evil deity. They believe that Jesus revealed through his more esoteric teachings, that there was a higher, ultimate, and pure deity beyond this realm which was the true origins of all creation. It was this higher being that Gnostic Christians worship. Am I anywhere near the mark on this?

So, with this in mind, I’m wondering if your question as seen through the lens of Gnostic Christianity, isn’t a question concerning the evil of the diety behind western religions that stands in the way of the ultimate god/being? In other words, if the god that western religions venerate is evil, then aren’t those religions evil also?

 
 
Greatest I am
 
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Greatest I am
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07 October 2017 15:22
 
Cheshire Cat - 07 October 2017 01:40 PM

Greatest I am, I see that you are a Gnostic Christian which I find interesting. I’ve done a little reading about Gnostic Christianity, including Elaine Pagel’s “The Gnostic Gospels.”

A good beginning. She started me on my Gnostic Christian path.

In a nutshell, Gnostic Christians believe that the god that the Jews, Muslims, and other Christians worship, is a false, flawed and even evil deity. They believe that Jesus revealed through his more esoteric teachings, that there was a higher, ultimate, and pure deity beyond this realm which was the true origins of all creation. It was this higher being that Gnostic Christians worship. Am I anywhere near the mark on this?

Sorry. No.

What you think we think is from our made up myths that we created to put against the Christian myth when all knew that all the Gods were myths. We have no supernatural beliefs.

From the esoteric/allegorical POV, these links shows more of what we believe. That being that we are the only God we can ever know. It is not based on a real Jesus as we think that Jesus is just an archetypal good man that was likely around way before Christianity was.

Some of it repeats but I wanted you to have the first link so that you might know an esoteric/allegory teacher/preacher.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gLIHeAYm7yE

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=alRNbesfXXw&feature=player_embedded

If you would like to share where you got your esoteric teachings, I would not mind having a look.

So, with this in mind, I’m wondering if your question as seen through the lens of Gnostic Christianity, isn’t a question concerning the evil of the diety behind western religions that stands in the way of the ultimate god/being? In other words, if the god that western religions venerate is evil, then aren’t those religions evil also?

They were not evil in the beginning, but literal reading while hiding the true meaning of what the sages like Jesus actually taught have made them into evil religions.

If religions like Christianity and Islam had remained God seekers instead of idol worshipers, they might have become moral ideologies but they did not.

This link speaks of that transition into the stupidity of literal reading of myths and how Gnostic Christians now see Jesus and God. Not a supernatural God but God defined as the best rules and laws to live life by.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oR02ciandvg&feature=BFa&list=PLCBF574D

Regards
DL

 

[ Edited: 07 October 2017 15:25 by Greatest I am]
 
Brick Bungalow
 
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Brick Bungalow
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07 October 2017 19:19
 
Greatest I am - 07 October 2017 08:57 AM
jdrnd - 07 October 2017 07:45 AM
Greatest I am - 06 October 2017 05:07 PM
Brick Bungalow - 06 October 2017 04:30 PM

Sometimes I struggle to know whether your questions are serious.

Answer it and find out.

Regards
DL

Brick, myself and others are always suspicious when someone asks a question without also expressing their opinion of what they think the answer is.

I and others here do not want to play the role of Plato and his peers.  I for one do not wanted to play Socrates foil.
It is easier for you to comment on our opinions than to express your own.
So
Do you think that if an ideology or religion is immoral and evil, it should be actively opposed?

Respectfully Submitted
Jeff

And here I thought that the site had just been infected with stupid people given the quality of the postings.

This is in the O.P. ” We have also called on all good people to actively oppose religions and ideologies that they feel are immoral and not deserving of their respect. ” ———and answers your question, so I guess you all are not stupid.

You just do not have reading comprehension.

Regards
DL

I think your ideology is immoral and I oppose it

 
dhave
 
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dhave
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07 October 2017 21:07
 
Brick Bungalow - 07 October 2017 07:19 PM
Greatest I am - 07 October 2017 08:57 AM
jdrnd - 07 October 2017 07:45 AM
Greatest I am - 06 October 2017 05:07 PM
Brick Bungalow - 06 October 2017 04:30 PM

Sometimes I struggle to know whether your questions are serious.

Answer it and find out.

Regards
DL

Brick, myself and others are always suspicious when someone asks a question without also expressing their opinion of what they think the answer is.

I and others here do not want to play the role of Plato and his peers.  I for one do not wanted to play Socrates foil.
It is easier for you to comment on our opinions than to express your own.
So
Do you think that if an ideology or religion is immoral and evil, it should be actively opposed?

Respectfully Submitted
Jeff

And here I thought that the site had just been infected with stupid people given the quality of the postings.

This is in the O.P. ” We have also called on all good people to actively oppose religions and ideologies that they feel are immoral and not deserving of their respect. ” ———and answers your question, so I guess you all are not stupid.

You just do not have reading comprehension.

Regards
DL

I think your ideology is immoral and I oppose it

Brick, don’t lose faith so quickly.  You know me, I’m stupid, and even I can see that Greatest I Am is great or, dare I say, the greatest.  One doesn’t need reason to see this, it is a simple transcendental knowledge that appears as a brilliant clarity in spite of one’s stupidity.  It’s really great.

The only concern I have is whether she prefers New England or Manhatten tomato-based clam chowder.

Regards,
Dave.

 

 
 
jdrnd
 
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jdrnd
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08 October 2017 07:12
 
Greatest I am - 07 October 2017 10:55 AM
Jdrnd - 07 October 2017 10:51 AM

  ...What a person is (good, bad, etc) varies with the ideology…

I think so, yes.


So then,
Since there are ideologies with opposing ideas of what constitutes ethical and moral behavior (and what is evil and immoral),
If everyone were to actively opposed what they felt to be evil and immoral behavior,
would our civilization not be in a constant state of conflict?

The reason why your question:

“If you think an ideology or religion is immoral and evil, should you actively oppose it?”

                            is loaded is because it contains controversial and opposing assumptions (issues).


They are
1. Of course one should oppose evil and immoral behavior.
2. What is considered evil and immoral not only varies from society to society, but also within societies.

I and possibly others are suspicious that if one were to answer “Yes” to assumption (1) you would respond with assumption (2).
On the other hand, if one were to answer your question by pointing out assumption (2), you might respond by saying
“We are all obligated to fight evil” or some phrase expressing that idea.


I usually do not interact with believers because there is an elusiveness to their posts.
I often feel that there is a hidden motive behind each post.. that is to somehow point out some irrationality about not believing in God,
or stated more succinctly to convert us.

FOR EXAMPLE, You included in your post:


“I am a Gnostic Christian and we have always seen it as part of our belief system to oppose immoral and evil belief systems. We are not pacifists but historically have done our ideological fighting with good arguments instead of violence.
We have also called on all good people to actively oppose religions and ideologies that they feel are immoral and not deserving of their respect. That is a take-off on the adage that for evil to grow, all good people need do is nothing. Gnostic Christians believe in spreading good ideologies.
Both Christianity and Islam, slave holding ideologies, have basically developed into intolerant, homophobic and misogynous religions. Both religions have grown themselves by the sword instead of good deeds and good moral arguments and continue with their immoral ways in spite of secular law showing them a better and more moral ways. Some of Christianity has adopted these better ways of late but Islam is lagging and fighting against ideological reform.
Jesus said we would know his people by their works and deeds. That means Jesus would not recognize Christians and Muslims as his people, and neither do I. Jesus would call Christianity and Islam abominations.
Gnostic Christians did call them out for their evils in the past, and I am proudly continuing that tradition and honest irrefutable evaluation based on morality.”

None of this was necessary if your thread was only to ask the questions in the first last sentences.

Sometimes, the person of faith implies that us non-believers are stupid, ignorant, etc. Non-believers do that as well to their discredit.

I have not said anything derogatory about you in this post.
I hope I have explained myself.


Jeff

 
Greatest I am
 
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Greatest I am
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08 October 2017 07:25
 
Brick Bungalow - 07 October 2017 07:19 PM
Greatest I am - 07 October 2017 08:57 AM
jdrnd - 07 October 2017 07:45 AM
Greatest I am - 06 October 2017 05:07 PM
Brick Bungalow - 06 October 2017 04:30 PM

Sometimes I struggle to know whether your questions are serious.

Answer it and find out.

Regards
DL

Brick, myself and others are always suspicious when someone asks a question without also expressing their opinion of what they think the answer is.

I and others here do not want to play the role of Plato and his peers.  I for one do not wanted to play Socrates foil.
It is easier for you to comment on our opinions than to express your own.
So
Do you think that if an ideology or religion is immoral and evil, it should be actively opposed?

Respectfully Submitted
Jeff

And here I thought that the site had just been infected with stupid people given the quality of the postings.

This is in the O.P. ” We have also called on all good people to actively oppose religions and ideologies that they feel are immoral and not deserving of their respect. ” ———and answers your question, so I guess you all are not stupid.

You just do not have reading comprehension.

Regards
DL

I think your ideology is immoral and I oppose it

Opposition without an argument is you p ing in the wind.

Debate, discuss or depart.

Regards
DL

 
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