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Healing Crystals

 
Chaz
 
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Chaz
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21 April 2018 15:53
 

I have some rules that I use for myself, and I’ll admit upfront that the list gets pretty weird. The third one I came up with is that I’m not allowed to have the initial thought that something is stupid. It shouldn’t take long to realize that is basically impossible, which is the point of it. If I think something is stupid, I have to use it as the subject of my favorite game; Devil’s Advocate.

I just started the game on this subject an hour ago, so I don’t have a conclusion yet, but I hit something that might be able to form an argument in favor of it and I want to see what you have to say about it.

It’s based on the idea that crystals are able to effect the energy of people, positively or negatively I’m assuming. Quartz is possibly the most well known, most likely because it’s more common than others. What’s mostly unknown about it is that it’s used in every computer on the planet. I’m not sure of the full details but it has some reaction to electricity, limiting it and storing it.

So the basis goes that since electricity is only one form of energy, and the aspects utilized are limitation and storage, could other crystals actually effect our emotions by absorbing the energy produced by them? There’s a scientific basis for the claim that dogs can smell fear, so fear is an emotion that actually does produce something released into the world, it’s not a far stretch to say other emotions produce something similar that we haven’t been able to detect yet.

Give me some thoughts on this, please and thank you. In favor or against honestly. The game is Devil’s Advocate so you can’t give an unacceptable response.

 
GAD
 
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GAD
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21 April 2018 18:15
 

There isn’t a single iota of data that shows that crystals do anything other then relieve suckers of their money.

 
 
Chaz
 
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Chaz
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21 April 2018 19:26
 

You don’t know how to play devil’s advocate?

I’m not suggesting to go spend all your money on a healer for your emotions. You immediately suck all the fun out of a hypothetical, and you might actually need to investigate the subject first hand, if only to get the metaphysical stick removed from your bum.

Use your imagination and try entertaining a thought. You stop learning when you stop questioning, and you might as well be dead. Let me know when I become insulting, just to be fair since your literal interpretation insulted the game.

 
MARTIN_UK
 
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MARTIN_UK
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22 April 2018 04:06
 

They could work!

I sleep with my back door key placed firmly under my tongue every night and I have never yet suffered from rickets.

Placebos work, there is data for it.

“so fear is an emotion that actually does produce something released into the world..” Yes it’s an odour called sweat.

 
Twissel
 
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Twissel
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22 April 2018 06:27
 

Crystals do work against snakebites ... provided the crystal is big enough to smash the snake’s skull in time.

 
 
Chaz
 
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Chaz
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22 April 2018 07:54
 

I was under the impression dogs reacted to pheromones.

The crystals don’t need to be very large to smash a snakes head but you need to be pretty fuckin quick.

You guys suck at this game. Am I the only one that can entertain a thought?

 
Skipshot
 
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Skipshot
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23 April 2018 06:36
 
Chaz - 22 April 2018 07:54 AM

You guys suck at this game. Am I the only one that can entertain a thought?

Add me to this list because I am not sure what the rules are.  Pretend to believe something and make arguments for it?

 
Cheshire Cat
 
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Cheshire Cat
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23 April 2018 13:38
 

I was in Sedona, Arizona last fall. One day, while hiking on a trail that looped around the airport, I looked down and spotted a crystal lying in the red dirt. The crystal was green, about three inches long, six-sided, triangular in shape, about an inch wide at the top tapering to a fine point at the bottom. At it’s top the crystal was capped and attached to a fine chain which had a metal sphere secured at the chain’s other end. It was obvious that one was supposed to hold the crystal by the metal sphere at the end of the chain and let the crystal dangle and swing from it.  I placed it in my pocket and returned to my nearby hotel room.

Around midnight, unable to sleep,  I decided to go for a stroll. My hotel was only a short walk to one of Sedona’s famous “Vortexes” — the Airport Vortex. The vortexes are places where the earth’s electromagnetic energy intersects, causing many people to experience unusual feelings or even achieve spiritual transformation.

I sat on top of the vortex rock, completely alone, admiring the view of Sedona in the moonlight. I suddenly remembered the crystal I had found that day and pulled it from my pocket. As a lark, I let the crystal dangle, holding the ball and chain with my index finger and thumb. The crystal instantly began to rotate in a circular, clockwise motion. It began to rotate faster. A dim light glowed from within the crystal and I felt an electric current slowly move from the crystal into my fingers, then up my arm, into my shoulder and neck, eventually centering in the middle of my forehead. This current of energy then enveloped my entire head and the world began to spin. The stars moved in circles around me, increasing in speed until a flash of light shattered the night and I transcended time and space, flying unhindered through the vastness of the universe as ball of pure consciousness.

I must have traveled for centuries, exploring the cosmos until a great force of some kind pulled at me. It felt like I was falling from a great height and at great speed. I awoke with a start, coming back to my senses, once again inside my body. It was dawn and I watched in wonder as the sun rose above the rust-red rock formations of Sedona.

I used to be like our friend GAD — a crystal skeptic.

Now I know better.

 
 
GAD
 
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GAD
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23 April 2018 17:36
 
Cheshire Cat - 23 April 2018 01:38 PM

I was in Sedona, Arizona last fall. One day, while hiking on a trail that looped around the airport, I looked down and spotted a crystal lying in the red dirt. The crystal was green, about three inches long, six-sided, triangular in shape, about an inch wide at the top tapering to a fine point at the bottom. At it’s top the crystal was capped and attached to a fine chain which had a metal sphere secured at the chain’s other end. It was obvious that one was supposed to hold the crystal by the metal sphere at the end of the chain and let the crystal dangle and swing from it.  I placed it in my pocket and returned to my nearby hotel room.

Around midnight, unable to sleep,  I decided to go for a stroll. My hotel was only a short walk to one of Sedona’s famous “Vortexes” — the Airport Vortex. The vortexes are places where the earth’s electromagnetic energy intersects, causing many people to experience unusual feelings or even achieve spiritual transformation.

I sat on top of the vortex rock, completely alone, admiring the view of Sedona in the moonlight. I suddenly remembered the crystal I had found that day and pulled it from my pocket. As a lark, I let the crystal dangle, holding the ball and chain with my index finger and thumb. The crystal instantly began to rotate in a circular, clockwise motion. It began to rotate faster. A dim light glowed from within the crystal and I felt an electric current slowly move from the crystal into my fingers, then up my arm, into my shoulder and neck, eventually centering in the middle of my forehead. This current of energy then enveloped my entire head and the world began to spin. The stars moved in circles around me, increasing in speed until a flash of light shattered the night and I transcended time and space, flying unhindered through the vastness of the universe as ball of pure consciousness.

I must have traveled for centuries, exploring the cosmos until a great force of some kind pulled at me. It felt like I was falling from a great height and at great speed. I awoke with a start, coming back to my senses, once again inside my body. It was dawn and I watched in wonder as the sun rose above the rust-red rock formations of Sedona.

I used to be like our friend GAD — a crystal skeptic.

Now I know better.

I remember that episode! What cartoon was that from?

I love Sedona, except for the crystals, vortexes, T-shits, incenses, candles, oh and that big church on the hill.

 
 
Chaz
 
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Chaz
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23 April 2018 17:41
 
Skipshot - 23 April 2018 06:36 AM

Add me to this list because I am not sure what the rules are.  Pretend to believe something and make arguments for it?

Basically, yes.  Whatever you believe to be true, is to be argued against, by you. It’s the basis for why I identify as an unorthodox anti-theist. I don’t believe in believing, I only believe in questioning.

That makes me sad. I didn’t expect the concept of devil’s advocate to be lost in history.

[quote author=“Cheshire cat”]

Sounds like DMT

[ Edited: 23 April 2018 17:47 by Chaz]
 
Cheshire Cat
 
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Cheshire Cat
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23 April 2018 19:07
 
GAD - 23 April 2018 05:36 PM
Cheshire Cat - 23 April 2018 01:38 PM

I was in Sedona, Arizona last fall. One day, while hiking on a trail that looped around the airport, I looked down and spotted a crystal lying in the red dirt. The crystal was green, about three inches long, six-sided, triangular in shape, about an inch wide at the top tapering to a fine point at the bottom. At it’s top the crystal was capped and attached to a fine chain which had a metal sphere secured at the chain’s other end. It was obvious that one was supposed to hold the crystal by the metal sphere at the end of the chain and let the crystal dangle and swing from it.  I placed it in my pocket and returned to my nearby hotel room.

Around midnight, unable to sleep,  I decided to go for a stroll. My hotel was only a short walk to one of Sedona’s famous “Vortexes” — the Airport Vortex. The vortexes are places where the earth’s electromagnetic energy intersects, causing many people to experience unusual feelings or even achieve spiritual transformation.

I sat on top of the vortex rock, completely alone, admiring the view of Sedona in the moonlight. I suddenly remembered the crystal I had found that day and pulled it from my pocket. As a lark, I let the crystal dangle, holding the ball and chain with my index finger and thumb. The crystal instantly began to rotate in a circular, clockwise motion. It began to rotate faster. A dim light glowed from within the crystal and I felt an electric current slowly move from the crystal into my fingers, then up my arm, into my shoulder and neck, eventually centering in the middle of my forehead. This current of energy then enveloped my entire head and the world began to spin. The stars moved in circles around me, increasing in speed until a flash of light shattered the night and I transcended time and space, flying unhindered through the vastness of the universe as ball of pure consciousness.

I must have traveled for centuries, exploring the cosmos until a great force of some kind pulled at me. It felt like I was falling from a great height and at great speed. I awoke with a start, coming back to my senses, once again inside my body. It was dawn and I watched in wonder as the sun rose above the rust-red rock formations of Sedona.

I used to be like our friend GAD — a crystal skeptic.

Now I know better.

I remember that episode! What cartoon was that from?

I love Sedona, except for the crystals, vortexes, T-shits, incenses, candles, oh and that big church on the hill.

Tsk, tsk.

Oh ye of little faith.

 
 
GAD
 
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GAD
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23 April 2018 20:10
 
Cheshire Cat - 23 April 2018 07:07 PM

I love Sedona, except for the crystals, vortexes, T-shits, incenses, candles, oh and that big church on the hill.

Tsk, tsk.

Oh ye of little faith.

I know :(

I lack faith in faith so I’m squared

 
 
sojourner
 
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sojourner
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24 April 2018 09:24
 

A few musings…


I think it’s possible we have some sort of wiring that responds favorably to crystals in the way that some people are afraid of bats or love the sound of the ocean - these were likely to be encountered in either negative or positive contexts, in our evolutionary past. I was in a cave full of anthodites not too long ago and I did find it remarkably serene - but then, I assume it would have been fortunate if our distant ancestors had the luck to find themselves in a secure cave (where, if I understand correctly, crystals tend to grow).


Next musing - a quote from Steve Pinker:

When energy is poured into a system, and the system dissipates that energy in its slide toward entropy, it can become poised in an orderly, indeed beautiful, configuration—a sphere, spiral, starburst, whirlpool, ripple, crystal, or fractal. The fact that we find these configurations beautiful, incidentally, suggests that beauty may not just be in the eye of the beholder. The brain’s aesthetic response may be a receptiveness to the counter-entropic patterns that can spring forth from nature.


I think anything that particularly floats your boat (or, alternately, freaks you out or puts you in a bad mood,) has the potential to influence what Buddhists might call the ‘subtle body’ and would in Western psychology fall somewhere just between subconscious and conscious perception. Not conscious in that you are directly, consciously thinking about it, but not entirely subconscious in that if you really pay attention, you can feel your mind being subtly tugged towards it over and over again. If it is a crystal bracelet that gives you a little burst of endorphins every time you catch it out of the corner of your eye, sure, I’m sure it does do your psyche some good. Again, alternately, I can feel intermittent bursts of panic throughout the day when I take my wedding rings in to be cleaned, as there is a moment of “ohgodohgodohgod did I lose my rings… oh no, wait, being cleaned” when I see they are missing. As diamonds are crystals, I could say the absence of crystals does indeed impact my mood negatively there. I can even see this being true for specific ailments - if you wear a crystal or oil on a part of your body that is hurting, and every time your mind is pulled toward that pain the crystal or oil then triggers the feedback of “What - stop - positive thought about this crystal or oil that I like,” then yes, I think that’s like a mini form of cognitive behavioral therapy. The negative thought “Ow, my ankle hurts!” is buffered somewhat by a more positive sensation “Aaaaw… pretty crystal anklet…”.


On a related note, I find the psychology of how such things grow quite interesting. I have friends who are very into essential oils these days, and I have finally purchased some myself, mostly out of the desire to be a good friend. I definitely see how, over time, spending 100 bucks on two tiny bottles of oil that generally have $5 grocery store equivalents (oregano, chamomile, lemon, etc.) starts to make sense. There is a baseline pleasant sensation with smelling pleasant things like lavender (just as, again, I think looking at pretty crystals is simply pleasant and pleasurable, in and of itself.) When you go to a sales-oriented get together, that pleasant sensation is paired with food, community, sharing of woes (Talking about what you want to use oils for - is it those terrible migraines? Anxiety? Weight? Etc.,) and then by the end you feel all lovey dovey and guilty not buying something - and once you do, there’s that old psychological mechanism wherein the more you invest in something, the more you are inclined to defend it (I could dig up a study if you want, but I am 99% sure this is a psychological ‘thing’.)


Besides that, there is generally a blend of the practical and the questionable in such areas. Crystals are pretty, make nice jewelry, and signal to other spiritual types that you are a fashionable spiritual type - plenty of real world positive use there. Oils smell nice and do have legitimate uses - peppermint water does settle your stomach, lemon water is quite refreshing, eucalyptus is soothing to raw airways, and so on. Then when more questionable claims about them healing your spleen or whatnot are thrown in, you can kinda go “Well, who knows, but this is definitely nice in water, even though it costs approximately 20 times as much as lemon juice, so what difference does it make? We can’t know everything for sure, after all, but I know I can use this for some things!” Same for the marketing. Companies like doTerra have some programs like “Science for kids” and “Healing Hands” charity that mix some things that are clearly positive (encouraging kids to learn science and offering activities and lessons on noncontroversial scientific topics; and helping those in underdeveloped nations, respectively) mixed with some ‘woo’ stuff about oils.


I have mixed feelings on all this. I think it is essentially an example of the pros and cons of capitalism (those motivated to sell you something are far less likely to do a half-assed job and to create good, engaging content - but they will also slide in whatever they’re trying to sell you). As an example of human psychology, however, I think it’s really interesting. I still don’t think essential oils have any particularly curative properties but I now know that I can be convinced to feel good about cutting my food budget (canned food is better than fresh anyways, right?) to spend questionable amounts of money on them given the right psychological backdrop (I’m helping a friend, she’ll be disappointed if her business doesn’t grow, I mean they are fun for so many different things, the company does good work, they do put me in a good mood, I think they have blogs for recipes…)

[ Edited: 24 April 2018 09:35 by sojourner]
 
 
Chaz
 
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Chaz
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24 April 2018 16:36
 
NL. - 24 April 2018 09:24 AM

A few…

That was a fantastic read. I’m thoroughly impressed and enjoyed it a lot.  I seriously didn’t find one thing to disagree with. I’m sure I can but that would be removing context and I can’t stand that. Everything from the historical and evolutionary aspects of finding the sights and smells soothing most likely from realizing the safety of the surroundings, that’s just fuckin brilliant.

I especially liked the denouncing of capitalistic abuse of others who are looking for help. I know it’s what GAD was aiming for but that was simply dismissive and I can’t agree that way. I was saying in the op I’m not allowed to simply think something is stupid because it’s dismissive and that is always a mistake. I stand with Harry Houdini on it completely. It’s wrong for people to take advantage of others, but that doesn’t mean you can’t utilize the ideas for your own benefit.

Fuckin shit you gave me a lot to think about, I’m gonna have to come back to this.

 
Brick Bungalow
 
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Brick Bungalow
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01 May 2018 13:08
 

I agree in the sense that I don’t like dogma or refusing to entertain new ideas. Who knows? Maybe crystals have properties that modern medicine can’t or won’t measure. Maybe they help people.

The test is crisis. You have some acute malady that causes you great pain and possibly threatens your life or the life of someone you love. The degree of confidence I have in crystal low. So low that I would exhaust a great many other options before going there.

I will confess to having a personal issue with alternative medicine. Several people close to me passed from terminal illness and managed to gut their families nest egg on things like crystal healing. As far as I can tell the only benefit was to the purveyors. The patients didn’t even receive a noticeable placebo effect. They died within the window predicted by the legitimate (by my estimation) physicians. So, to me, its not simply an issue of harmless disagreement. These things often cost thousands of dollars and the people who are charged are in their absolute extremity.

I can have good humor about it in the pure hypothetical but if I meet a crystal healer who preys on terminal people and charges more than the fair market cost of the minerals in question there will be a confrontation.

 
jdrnd
 
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jdrnd
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20 May 2018 17:36
 
Chaz - 21 April 2018 03:53 PM

could other crystals actually effect our emotions by absorbing the energy produced by them? There’s a scientific basis for the claim that dogs can smell fear.

 


You are correct.

Methylmalonic acid, when allowed to freeze, contains a hydrogen moiety that can bend plasma beams made of coiffure rays.  The problem with coiffure mediated energy beams is that they change frequency when exposed to nitrogen gas.  As you are aware nitrogen is a major component of our terrestrial atmosphere.  I have a buddy who has been able to get limited results by exposing sulfated demethylated malonic acid to hematite using a modified Bemer reaction. Unfortunately it takes a lot of energy and his result is limited to getting hedgehogs to salivate when presented with a crushed almond joy candy bar.

 
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