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Is it Racist to Say a Black Person Looks Like an Ape—if You Don’t Know They’re Black?

 
Antisocialdarwinist
 
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Antisocialdarwinist
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31 May 2018 15:02
 

I didn’t realize Valerie Jarrett was black. So when the brouhaha over Roseanne Barr’s tweet broke, I didn’t understand why Barr was being accused of racism. Didn’t Bill Maher compare Donald Trump to an orangutan? He wasn’t accused of racism. So why was Barr? Only later did I find out Jarrett has at least one black grandparent.

If Barr knew that Jarrett was black, that’s one thing. But if you believe Barr, she didn’t know. For the sake of argument, let’s assume she’s being honest about that. Given that assumption, does she deserve to be labeled a racist for comparing Jarrett to an ape?

[ Edited: 31 May 2018 15:05 by Antisocialdarwinist]
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LadyJane
 
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LadyJane
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31 May 2018 15:34
 

It doesn’t matter.  It was delivered at a time Americans are itching for a reason to overreact because they’re offended or underreact because they’ve never faced discrimination in their lives.  If it was meant as a joke–it backfired.  The comment was directed at two minority groups under constant target so you take your chances as a comedian and must suffer the consequences of the fallout.  And the casualties of haphazardly tweeting things people went on to later regret are mounting.  There’s no making excuses for this anymore.  Stop fucking lying people.  And stop accepting being lied to.  I want to respect you but you’re making it impossible.

 
 
hannahtoo
 
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hannahtoo
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31 May 2018 16:59
 

People who try to rack up followers on Twitter by being outrageously obnoxious must know the risks.  And a woman who picks up her phone to tweet after taking Ambien is a fool.  I wasn’t surprised by Ms. Barr’s latest actions, nor the results.

 
Antisocialdarwinist
 
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31 May 2018 17:39
 

The exact text of Barr’s tweet read, “muslim brotherhood & planet of the apes had a baby=vj.” This in response to someone else’s tweet regarding Valerie Jarrett.

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bbearren
 
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bbearren
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31 May 2018 17:51
 

“Roseanne Barr

@therealroseanne


hey guys, don’t defend me, it’s sweet of you 2 try, but…losing my show is 0 compared 2 being labelled a racist over one tweet-that I regret even more.”

“guys I did something unforgiveable so do not defend me. It was 2 in the morning and I was ambien tweeting-it was memorial day too-i went 2 far & do not want it defended-it was egregious Indefensible. I made a mistake I wish I hadn’t but…don’t defend it please. ty

— Roseanne Barr (@therealroseanne) May 30, 2018”

 
 
LadyJane
 
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31 May 2018 18:09
 

If she knew then she made a racist joke.  If she didn’t know then she simply associated her with the Obama administration and assumed Obama was a black Muslim.  Making it racist and Islamophobic.  Plus, I don’t buy the Ambien excuse.  That is just the backpedalling that seems to follow these events.  I’m sick of watching comedians apologize for making jokes when they feel pressured and don’t actually mean it.  Stand by your jokes or don’t tell them in the first place.  A decision almost exclusively based on how much you have to lose.  And how much of a risk taker you are.

 
 
Celal
 
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31 May 2018 18:17
 
Antisocialdarwinist - 31 May 2018 03:02 PM

I didn’t realize Valerie Jarrett was black. So when the brouhaha over Roseanne Barr’s tweet broke, I didn’t understand why Barr was being accused of racism. Didn’t Bill Maher compare Donald Trump to an orangutan? He wasn’t accused of racism. So why was Barr? Only later did I find out Jarrett has at least one black grandparent.

You touch on the very core of something worth exploring!  I didn’t realize she was part black either.  But, so what?

Why does being black or partially black immune someone from being a target of such jokes or attacks. If the joke is in bad taste, why isn’t it in bad taste when a white person is targeted?  If Howard Cosell can call his grand children running around the yard “little monkeys”; why is it taken differently when he referred to a Washington Red Skins WR a little monkey running? And all hell broke loose!

Where does the offense originate? The person who unwittingly utter a phrase meaning no harm or the person who only sees the certain members of a race in a prejudged context and unable to get their heads around notion that we are all equal and we should all be treated the same, and feel compelled to rush to the defense of blacks.

I think people who cry racism too much, confuse it as a substitute for arguments.

[ Edited: 31 May 2018 18:20 by Celal]
 
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31 May 2018 18:24
 
Antisocialdarwinist - 31 May 2018 03:02 PM

I didn’t realize Valerie Jarrett was black. So when the brouhaha over Roseanne Barr’s tweet broke, I didn’t understand why Barr was being accused of racism. Didn’t Bill Maher compare Donald Trump to an orangutan? He wasn’t accused of racism. So why was Barr? Only later did I find out Jarrett has at least one black grandparent.

If Barr knew that Jarrett was black, that’s one thing. But if you believe Barr, she didn’t know. For the sake of argument, let’s assume she’s being honest about that. Given that assumption, does she deserve to be labeled a racist for comparing Jarrett to an ape?

Pleading ignorance is the flimsiest cover.  Roseanne knew exactly what she was writing about, and so did her audience, even if you didn’t.

 
hannahtoo
 
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hannahtoo
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31 May 2018 18:44
 

Yes, “monkey” has different connotations in different contexts.  It is an endearment when talking about children running and playing and chattering.  It is an insult when used to infer that adults have low intelligence or ape-like features.

I agree that reactions to insults are not all equal.  Media stars have always been subject to judgement for their personal persona, as have politicians.  Whether this is right or wrong is a different question.  Rosanne Barr became a liability, as she offended too many people, and important sponsors pulled their support.  So she was fired.

 
GAD
 
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GAD
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31 May 2018 19:33
 

Social politics.

 
 
bbearren
 
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31 May 2018 22:26
 
 
 
Celal
 
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01 June 2018 09:04
 
hannahtoo - 31 May 2018 06:44 PM

Yes, “monkey” has different connotations in different contexts.  It is an endearment when talking about children running and playing and chattering.  It is an insult when used to infer that adults have low intelligence or ape-like features.

I agree that reactions to insults are not all equal.  Media stars have always been subject to judgement for their personal persona, as have politicians.  Whether this is right or wrong is a different question.  Rosanne Barr became a liability, as she offended too many people, and important sponsors pulled their support.  So she was fired.

As is usual you play as if you don’t get the salient point.

The point is why is it ok to frequently compare Trump(or any white person) to Orangutan as pictured in the attached by the left but not ok if Obama(or any black person) is compared to an ape?  This is a serious question. 

Why is it that 1/2 black Obama is considered black, not white?  Why is it that Valerie Jarret who appears even less black than Obama   considered black?  What the hell is “The one-drop rule”  ?  How can the left reconcile the stupid and racist “one drop rule”  with its implications of racial purity whilst feigning outrage of pretending to protect the blacks from the right.

The only thing that I see wrong in this whole sorry ass episode is not black/white or the jokes but the left’s insidious use of black race as pawns for its own purposes.  That is sick.

 

 

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01 June 2018 11:20
 

Stop pretending comparing Black to apes is not racist. It is

 
hannahtoo
 
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hannahtoo
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01 June 2018 12:01
 

It is not nice/civil to compare Trump to an orangutan.  However, it is up to HBO to decide whether Bill Maher’s commentary should continue.  Face it, there is no long history of comparing white people to orangutans.  It came up with Trump, I suppose, because he has orange hair.  It is similar to Trevor Noah comparing Senator Mitch McConnell to a turtle.  But there is undoubtedly a well-documented history of denigrating African Americans by comparing them to monkeys.  And Roseanne was very aware of that.  Her network disapproved of her slur as it offended her audience, others on her show, and probably ABC admin.  So she’s gone.

Please don’t pretend that Barack Obama is not obviously considered “black” by everyone who sees his picture for the first time.

Valerie Jarrett looks more or less African American, depending on the photo.  She is genetically one-half AA.  And she was born in Iran to American parents.  The family lived in Iran for 5 years.  I bet that’s why Rosanne made the Muslim Brotherhood part of the quip.  BTW Roseanne also tweeted about Susan Rice (another AA woman from Obama’s admin) in 2013 saying, “susan rice is a man with big swinging ape balls.”

Roseanne is a loose canon, and ABC probably regrets trying the reboot.

Political figures are fair game for ridicule in the US.  They call each other liars and crooks.  The media join in the fray.  Now with Twitter, everyone can get in on it.  I repeat, it isn’t nice.  Where is the line?  That’s a good question.  Trump accused Obama of faking his citizenship.  He tried to link Ted Cruz’s father to the Kennedy assassination.  Check on Wikipedia to see a list of dozens of derogatory nicknames Trump has used for his political adversaries.  When does it all get to be too much?  I guess when it’s too much for the public. 

For me, the final straw on Trump was when he mocked the movements of a disabled reporter.  Ever since then, I refuse to watch Trump speak.  I occasionally read a transcript of his remarks.  I cannot tolerate the sight or sound of the man.  To some folks, maybe Rosanne was not over the line.  But currently, race is a major hot button issue.  Rosanne obviously angered enough people.  That appears to be what counts in the television biz.

[ Edited: 01 June 2018 12:27 by hannahtoo]
 
Celal
 
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01 June 2018 15:27
 
hannahtoo - 01 June 2018 12:01 PM

For me, the final straw on Trump was when he mocked the movements of a disabled reporter.  Ever since then, I refuse to watch Trump speak.  I occasionally read a transcript of his remarks.  I cannot tolerate the sight or sound of the man.

Mocking someone’s physical disabilities!  What evidence did you have to believe that? Did you see Serge Kovaleski , the reporter   in a video interview and compared his illness to what Trump did?  Of course not.  You could not have because it doesn’t exist. They lied and you bought it!

Here is the truth!

Serge Kovaleski has arthrogryposis, which locks his wrists in place, actually preventing movement.  That is exact opposite of what Trump does and did when he supposedly mocked him, claimed by Washington Post. The reason the media never showed an interview with the reporter is that if you ever saw him speaking, it would be blindingly obvious (even to the liberals) that Trump’s imitation isn’t in the same universe as Serge’s affliction. Serge speaks calmly. He does not twitch, jerk or flail his arms.

Here this link provides photographic evidence   that when Trump discusses issues ,
https://www.catholics4trump.com/even-more-video-evidence-trump-did-not-mock-reporters-disability/
he imitates a flustered general.  You guessed it he does the exact same arm flailing.  In another speech, Trump pretended to be Ted Cruz. Again, he does the exact same arm flailing. Once again!  Neither the general nor Cruz is disabled.  At least no physical disabilities.

This was (Washington Post) media’s most successful lie about Donald Trump: that he mocked a man for being disabled. They never told you what his illness was. They allowed you to believe what was implied. It played well with the naive. To ensure the lie stuck with the sheep, the post removed all videos from the comment section of the article that advanced the lie.

As he can be seen in this interview, the reporter’s arms are locked and quite calm. But the media never showed this interview just the still pictures to   trick the public into believing he has something like cerebral palsy.  He didn’t   he has arthrogryposis.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u-OYpv5fImA

 

 
hannahtoo
 
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01 June 2018 16:17
 
Celal - 01 June 2018 03:27 PM
hannahtoo - 01 June 2018 12:01 PM

For me, the final straw on Trump was when he mocked the movements of a disabled reporter.  Ever since then, I refuse to watch Trump speak.  I occasionally read a transcript of his remarks.  I cannot tolerate the sight or sound of the man.

Mocking someone’s physical disabilities!  What evidence did you have to believe that? Did you see Serge Kovaleski , the reporter   in a video interview and compared his illness to what Trump did?  Of course not.  You could not have because it doesn’t exist. They lied and you bought it!

Here is the truth!

Serge Kovaleski has arthrogryposis, which locks his wrists in place, actually preventing movement.  That is exact opposite of what Trump does and did when he supposedly mocked him, claimed by Washington Post. The reason the media never showed an interview with the reporter is that if you ever saw him speaking, it would be blindingly obvious (even to the liberals) that Trump’s imitation isn’t in the same universe as Serge’s affliction. Serge speaks calmly. He does not twitch, jerk or flail his arms.

Here this link provides photographic evidence   that when Trump discusses issues ,
https://www.catholics4trump.com/even-more-video-evidence-trump-did-not-mock-reporters-disability/
he imitates a flustered general.  You guessed it he does the exact same arm flailing.  In another speech, Trump pretended to be Ted Cruz. Again, he does the exact same arm flailing. Once again!  Neither the general nor Cruz is disabled.  At least no physical disabilities.

This was (Washington Post) media’s most successful lie about Donald Trump: that he mocked a man for being disabled. They never told you what his illness was. They allowed you to believe what was implied. It played well with the naive. To ensure the lie stuck with the sheep, the post removed all videos from the comment section of the article that advanced the lie.

As he can be seen in this interview, the reporter’s arms are locked and quite calm. But the media never showed this interview just the still pictures to   trick the public into believing he has something like cerebral palsy.  He didn’t   he has arthrogryposis.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u-OYpv5fImA

You can look at Snopes.com and decide for yourself. 
https://www.snopes.com/news/2016/07/28/donald-trump-criticized-for-mocking-disabled-reporter/

The generous conclusion is that Trump just mocks lots of people by pretending they’re spastics.  Very funny, huh?

And two more about the alleged incidents that sparked the derision:
https://www.nytimes.com/politics/first-draft/2015/11/24/the-video-of-celebrations-that-was-broadcast-on-911/

http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/statements/2015/nov/22/donald-trump/fact-checking-trumps-claim-thousands-new-jersey-ch/

Trump loves to ridicule and bully people.  Not disagree with them or express a strong opinion.  Ridicule and bully.  This is in addition to his lies.  For example, Trump has stuck to his claim that “thousands of people were cheering” in New Jersey as the World Trade Center buildings came down.  There is no evidence of this, and the only film footage is from the Middle East.  Apparently the reporter had written that “a number of people” were questioned for allegedly celebrating (they were released without charge), but never “thousands.”  And Trump was mocking him for clarifying what he’d written.  Trump obviously was conflating the Palestinian footage with rumors of events in New Jersey.  Playing loose with the facts and doubling down on falsehoods.  He is a terrible example to have as leader of our country.

 
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