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The Pope Condemns the Death Penalty

 
EN
 
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EN
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02 August 2018 08:05
 

https://www.cnn.com/2018/08/02/europe/pope-death-penalty-intl/index.html

Basically, he says it’s against human dignity. I’m against it for another reason - the State should never be given this power. Absolute power corrupts absolutely, and if the State has this power it will eventually abuse it, as it often has in the past. It’s better (and less expensive) to simply give life imprisonment without right of parole.  That is a smaller government and less expensive (in other words, Conservative) solution.

 
burt
 
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burt
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02 August 2018 10:00
 
EN - 02 August 2018 08:05 AM

https://www.cnn.com/2018/08/02/europe/pope-death-penalty-intl/index.html

Basically, he says it’s against human dignity. I’m against it for another reason - the State should never be given this power. Absolute power corrupts absolutely, and if the State has this power it will eventually abuse it, as it often has in the past. It’s better (and less expensive) to simply give life imprisonment without right of parole.  That is a smaller government and less expensive (in other words, Conservative) solution.

Wait a moment, how is life in prison less expensive than a death penalty?

 
EN
 
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EN
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02 August 2018 11:45
 
burt - 02 August 2018 10:00 AM
EN - 02 August 2018 08:05 AM

https://www.cnn.com/2018/08/02/europe/pope-death-penalty-intl/index.html

Basically, he says it’s against human dignity. I’m against it for another reason - the State should never be given this power. Absolute power corrupts absolutely, and if the State has this power it will eventually abuse it, as it often has in the past. It’s better (and less expensive) to simply give life imprisonment without right of parole.  That is a smaller government and less expensive (in other words, Conservative) solution.

Wait a moment, how is life in prison less expensive than a death penalty?

Takes hundreds of thousands of bucks to convict and then go through all the appeals before you actually get to the execution.

http://www.nbcnews.com/id/29552692/ns/us_news-crime_and_courts/t/execute-or-not-question-cost/#.W2NPsE2WyUk

 

[ Edited: 02 August 2018 11:47 by EN]
 
GAD
 
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02 August 2018 17:19
 

It’s the pope, speaking from a position of ignorance, myth, magic and superstition, so it’s pointless and irrelevant.

 
 
GAD
 
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02 August 2018 17:23
 
burt - 02 August 2018 10:00 AM
EN - 02 August 2018 08:05 AM

https://www.cnn.com/2018/08/02/europe/pope-death-penalty-intl/index.html

Basically, he says it’s against human dignity. I’m against it for another reason - the State should never be given this power. Absolute power corrupts absolutely, and if the State has this power it will eventually abuse it, as it often has in the past. It’s better (and less expensive) to simply give life imprisonment without right of parole.  That is a smaller government and less expensive (in other words, Conservative) solution.

Wait a moment, how is life in prison less expensive than a death penalty?

We made it that way so we could keep people suffering in a hell hole for life to make ourselves feel good about how moral we are.

 
 
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03 August 2018 00:53
 
GAD - 02 August 2018 05:19 PM

It’s the pope, speaking from a position of ignorance, myth, magic and superstition, so it’s pointless and irrelevant.

If it’s right, it’s right - regardless of the source.

 
GAD
 
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03 August 2018 07:32
 
EN - 03 August 2018 12:53 AM
GAD - 02 August 2018 05:19 PM

It’s the pope, speaking from a position of ignorance, myth, magic and superstition, so it’s pointless and irrelevant.

If it’s right, it’s right - regardless of the source.

First, it’s not right, second, basing right on magic is why religion has killed 100’s of millions.

 
 
Skipshot
 
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03 August 2018 08:06
 

I’m against the death penalty for how it appeals to humanity’s cruelty and desire for vengeance by calling it justice, and then for how it is then abused.

 
GAD
 
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03 August 2018 08:12
 
Skipshot - 03 August 2018 08:06 AM

I’m against the death penalty for how it appeals to humanity’s cruelty and desire for vengeance by calling it justice, and then for how it is then abused.

Neither are necessary nor any worse then a shitty life in prison for the same reasons, the only difference is how you feel about it.

 
 
EN
 
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03 August 2018 08:19
 
GAD - 03 August 2018 08:12 AM
Skipshot - 03 August 2018 08:06 AM

I’m against the death penalty for how it appeals to humanity’s cruelty and desire for vengeance by calling it justice, and then for how it is then abused.

Neither are necessary nor any worse then a shitty life in prison for the same reasons, the only difference is how you feel about it.

What is worse is giving the State this level of authority, and then having it abuse that for corrupt purposes, which it inevitably will do.  That is why my opposition to the death penalty is grounded in the concept of limited government rather than human dignity.

 
GAD
 
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03 August 2018 08:40
 
EN - 03 August 2018 08:19 AM
GAD - 03 August 2018 08:12 AM
Skipshot - 03 August 2018 08:06 AM

I’m against the death penalty for how it appeals to humanity’s cruelty and desire for vengeance by calling it justice, and then for how it is then abused.

Neither are necessary nor any worse then a shitty life in prison for the same reasons, the only difference is how you feel about it.

What is worse is giving the State this level of authority, and then having it abuse that for corrupt purposes, which it inevitably will do.  That is why my opposition to the death penalty is grounded in the concept of limited government rather than human dignity.

But the authority to put people in shitty prisons for life and then having it abuse that for corrupt purposes is OK?

 
 
Skipshot
 
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03 August 2018 09:27
 
GAD - 03 August 2018 08:12 AM
Skipshot - 03 August 2018 08:06 AM

I’m against the death penalty for how it appeals to humanity’s cruelty and desire for vengeance by calling it justice, and then for how it is then abused.

Neither are necessary nor any worse then a shitty life in prison for the same reasons, the only difference is how you feel about it.

What is your proposal instead of death or imprisonment?

[ Edited: 03 August 2018 10:47 by Skipshot]
 
Cheshire Cat
 
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03 August 2018 10:12
 

There’s an even more compelling reason for the abolishment of the death penalty which is that innocent people can be killed and probably have been.

From Amnesty International:

Since 1973, 151 people have been released from death rows throughout the country due to evidence of their wrongful convictions. In 2003 alone, 10 wrongfully convicted defendants were released from death row.

I would rather have a thousand guilty men live in prison for the rest of their lives than have one innocent man executed by the state.

 
 
nonverbal
 
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nonverbal
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03 August 2018 10:59
 
Cheshire Cat - 03 August 2018 10:12 AM

There’s an even more compelling reason for the abolishment of the death penalty which is that innocent people can be killed and probably have been.

From Amnesty International:

Since 1973, 151 people have been released from death rows throughout the country due to evidence of their wrongful convictions. In 2003 alone, 10 wrongfully convicted defendants were released from death row.

I would rather have a thousand guilty men live in prison for the rest of their lives than have one innocent man executed by the state.

That’s I think the strongest anti-death penalty argument. The outrageous expense that comes with legal execution is also truly unacceptable. GAD, however, doesn’t accept the latter argument because he lives in a dream where attorneys earn $20 per hour.

 
SkepticX
 
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03 August 2018 11:03
 
GAD - 03 August 2018 08:12 AM
Skipshot - 03 August 2018 08:06 AM

I’m against the death penalty for how it appeals to humanity’s cruelty and desire for vengeance by calling it justice, and then for how it is then abused.

Neither are necessary nor any worse then a shitty life in prison for the same reasons, the only difference is how you feel about it.


Projection doesn’t count as genuine understanding of others, and it tends to be pretty transparent to those who don’t share pretty much the same issue(s). Seems to me it also tends to be a kind of counterfeit form of self-assurance:
  - I’m so self-aware and comfortable with my personal sensibilities I see right through those who disagree with me because they aren’t.

And of course that unusual level of comfortable self-awareness is also why so many such self-assured and self-aware types seem to feel the urge to attack those who lack their same sense of confidence and self-awareness ... heh.

 
 
EN
 
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03 August 2018 11:41
 
GAD - 03 August 2018 08:40 AM
EN - 03 August 2018 08:19 AM
GAD - 03 August 2018 08:12 AM
Skipshot - 03 August 2018 08:06 AM

I’m against the death penalty for how it appeals to humanity’s cruelty and desire for vengeance by calling it justice, and then for how it is then abused.

Neither are necessary nor any worse then a shitty life in prison for the same reasons, the only difference is how you feel about it.

What is worse is giving the State this level of authority, and then having it abuse that for corrupt purposes, which it inevitably will do.  That is why my opposition to the death penalty is grounded in the concept of limited government rather than human dignity.

But the authority to put people in shitty prisons for life and then having it abuse that for corrupt purposes is OK?

No, but it’s better than killing. At least a person who is alive has a chance to prove innocence and get out, or get a pardon.

 
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