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Cohen & Manafort

 
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22 August 2018 04:44
 

Of the two events, Cohen’s confession seems the most troublesome for the President.  A former attorney and campaign insider, he specifically stated that he committed felonies at the candidate’s direction.  Then his attorney, Lanny Davis, stated on TRMS that Cohen was prepared to testify about both collusion and obstruction with the President’s knowledge with respect to the Trump Tower meeting and Russian email hacking.  Manafort still faces another trial.  Four former Trump insiders are now felons.  I’m glad I’m me and not the President.

 
Jan_CAN
 
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Jan_CAN
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22 August 2018 06:01
 
EN - 22 August 2018 04:44 AM

Of the two events, Cohen’s confession seems the most troublesome for the President.  A former attorney and campaign insider, he specifically stated that he committed felonies at the candidate’s direction.  Then his attorney, Lanny Davis, stated on TRMS that Cohen was prepared to testify about both collusion and obstruction with the President’s knowledge with respect to the Trump Tower meeting and Russian email hacking.  Manafort still faces another trial.  Four former Trump insiders are now felons.  I’m glad I’m me and not the President.

Been watching CNN and the discussions about difficulties regarding possible indictment and impeachment of the POTUS.  It was also mentioned that the statute of limitations on some of these offenses is five years and that charges could be delayed until the end of his term.

In recalling Nixon’s resignation under threat of impeachment, I wonder if there is any possibility that Trump would resign, if and only if there was a (behind-the-scenes?) deal that future criminal charges would not be pursued if he were to resign.  (That is, if indisputable evidence was uncovered and he felt himself cornered.)

[ Edited: 22 August 2018 06:43 by Jan_CAN]
 
 
hannahtoo
 
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hannahtoo
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22 August 2018 07:19
 

What I don’t get is why the Republican Party doesn’t see fit to oust Trump and install Mike Pence as President.  OK, yeah, an impeachment would be a big distraction from whatever it is the the Congress is doing otherwise.  But they could put pressure on Trump to resign and get it all over more quickly.  Pence supports the conservative Republican agenda better than Trump.  And he’d be much more diplomatic on the world stage.  Yes, Trump has a core of devoted followers.  But seriously, he is becoming an increasing liability to all but the unshakable core.

Trump’s approval rating last week was 42%.  I’m wondering what it will be after this week?  I must admit I am continually surprised by the fact that Trump rates as high as he does.  The only rationale I can think of is a combo of people supporting his deregulation (seeing it as freedom) and his Supreme Court choices.

 
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22 August 2018 07:30
 
hannahtoo - 22 August 2018 07:19 AM

What I don’t get is why the Republican Party doesn’t see fit to oust Trump and install Mike Pence as President.  OK, yeah, an impeachment would be a big distraction from whatever it is the the Congress is doing otherwise.  But they could put pressure on Trump to resign and get it all over more quickly.  Pence supports the conservative Republican agenda better than Trump.  And he’d be much more diplomatic on the world stage.  Yes, Trump has a core of devoted followers.  But seriously, he is becoming an increasing liability to all but the unshakable core.

Trump’s approval rating last week was 42%.  I’m wondering what it will be after this week?  I must admit I am continually surprised by the fact that Trump rates as high as he does.  The only rationale I can think of is a combo of people supporting his deregulation (seeing it as freedom) and his Supreme Court choices.

As long as his supporters remain strong, the GOP cannot touch him. Otherwise, any Congressman who opposed him would get primaried by someone claiming to be a loyalist.

Trump will not resign unless he sees a financial opportunity.  If he can get himself and his cronies cleared (he can pardon everyone right now, and get Pence to pardon him), then he can resign, claim he had to do it to protect Ivanka against “a rigged system, a witch hunt, a disgrace”, and become the mouthpiece for the extreme right, criticizing everything the government did.  He could make millions as a talk-show host, railing against everything.

 
ubique13
 
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22 August 2018 07:45
 
EN - 22 August 2018 07:30 AM
hannahtoo - 22 August 2018 07:19 AM

What I don’t get is why the Republican Party doesn’t see fit to oust Trump and install Mike Pence as President.  OK, yeah, an impeachment would be a big distraction from whatever it is the the Congress is doing otherwise.  But they could put pressure on Trump to resign and get it all over more quickly.  Pence supports the conservative Republican agenda better than Trump.  And he’d be much more diplomatic on the world stage.  Yes, Trump has a core of devoted followers.  But seriously, he is becoming an increasing liability to all but the unshakable core.

Trump’s approval rating last week was 42%.  I’m wondering what it will be after this week?  I must admit I am continually surprised by the fact that Trump rates as high as he does.  The only rationale I can think of is a combo of people supporting his deregulation (seeing it as freedom) and his Supreme Court choices.

As long as his supporters remain strong, the GOP cannot touch him. Otherwise, any Congressman who opposed him would get primaried by someone claiming to be a loyalist.

Trump will not resign unless he sees a financial opportunity.  If he can get himself and his cronies cleared (he can pardon everyone right now, and get Pence to pardon him), then he can resign, claim he had to do it to protect Ivanka against “a rigged system, a witch hunt, a disgrace”, and become the mouthpiece for the extreme right, criticizing everything the government did.  He could make millions as a talk-show host, railing against everything.

Cohen and Manafort were the easy pickings. This ride is about to get a lot more bumpy.

 
 
Jan_CAN
 
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22 August 2018 07:48
 
hannahtoo - 22 August 2018 07:19 AM

What I don’t get is why the Republican Party doesn’t see fit to oust Trump and install Mike Pence as President.  OK, yeah, an impeachment would be a big distraction from whatever it is the the Congress is doing otherwise.  But they could put pressure on Trump to resign and get it all over more quickly.  Pence supports the conservative Republican agenda better than Trump.  And he’d be much more diplomatic on the world stage.  Yes, Trump has a core of devoted followers.  But seriously, he is becoming an increasing liability to all but the unshakable core.
...

Although many cannot imagine a worse President than the current one, there are also concerns that Pence could be even worse in that he might be more effective. 

For one thing, his evangelical faith should be of serious concern.

https://www.vanityfair.com/news/2018/02/omarosa-is-right-why-president-pence-could-be-more-terrifying-than-trump
https://www.newsweek.com/so-you-think-president-pence-would-be-better-trump-think-again-751099

Could it be a case of ‘be careful what you wish for’?  Hard to tell.

 

 
 
ubique13
 
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22 August 2018 08:00
 
Jan_CAN - 22 August 2018 07:48 AM
hannahtoo - 22 August 2018 07:19 AM

What I don’t get is why the Republican Party doesn’t see fit to oust Trump and install Mike Pence as President.  OK, yeah, an impeachment would be a big distraction from whatever it is the the Congress is doing otherwise.  But they could put pressure on Trump to resign and get it all over more quickly.  Pence supports the conservative Republican agenda better than Trump.  And he’d be much more diplomatic on the world stage.  Yes, Trump has a core of devoted followers.  But seriously, he is becoming an increasing liability to all but the unshakable core.
...

Although many cannot imagine a worse President than the current one, there are also concerns that Pence could be even worse in that he might be more effective. 

For one thing, his evangelical faith should be of serious concern.

https://www.vanityfair.com/news/2018/02/omarosa-is-right-why-president-pence-could-be-more-terrifying-than-trump
https://www.newsweek.com/so-you-think-president-pence-would-be-better-trump-think-again-751099

Could it be a case of ‘be careful what you wish for’?  Hard to tell.

Elevating Mike Pence to the Presidency would essentially be bending the knee to the pall of totalitarianism. But what would make anyone think that he’s not also implicated in the broader scope of the investigation?

 
 
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22 August 2018 08:04
 

We need to flip at least one house of Congress in November. Maybe this will help.  We’ll see.  Agree that the ride is about to get bumpy.

 
hannahtoo
 
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22 August 2018 10:27
 

I don’t see pardoning as the same as clearing someone.  It can make a person seem even more sleazy.  Probably why Cohen said he wouldn’t accept a pardon.  His only hope for the future is to serve time and then retreat to some island, or write a tell-all book.  But I’m no expert on public perception.  I was shocked to see Oliver North resurrected as a commentator, though not surprised he came to head the NRA.

The idea of Trump remaining a cultural force after leaving office makes me nauseous.  So probably better if he doesn’t resign and preserve his spin on events.  Best if he’s trounced in the 2020 election and then hit with an unending series of lawsuits and indictments.  I wouldn’t be surprised if some incriminating tapes come out right before the election.  Like Trump using the N-word.  Or Trump telling Cohen not to worry about his campaign “donation,” since Russian money would cover his repayment…or some such.  And I also hope Melania and Barron get free of him. 

As for Pence being an evangelical—whether Trump or Pence is in the Oval Office, a social conservative is going to get appointed to the Supreme Court this round.  Let’s just hope RB Ginsberg hangs on through 2020.

 
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22 August 2018 10:43
 
hannahtoo - 22 August 2018 10:27 AM

I don’t see pardoning as the same as clearing someone.  It can make a person seem even more sleazy.  Probably why Cohen said he wouldn’t accept a pardon.  His only hope for the future is to serve time and then retreat to some island, or write a tell-all book.  But I’m no expert on public perception.  I was shocked to see Oliver North resurrected as a commentator, though not surprised he came to head the NRA.

It’s not an accident that the Middle-Eastern powers have seemingly united in opposition to Tehran. I would even venture a guess that there’s more to the ibn Saud and ibn Ladin families than will ever be made public.

 
 
Celal
 
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22 August 2018 11:15
 
EN - 22 August 2018 04:44 AM

Of the two events, Cohen’s confession seems the most troublesome for the President.

So when Obama in 2008 is found to be in violation of Campaign Finance laws, he is only fined, but if Trump is accused of the same, it is a capital offense.  That is nice, dear!  Where did you get your law license? You can’t even separate what you wish to have happen and what can be allowed to happen legally.

https://www.politico.com/story/2013/01/obama-2008-campaign-fined-375000-085784

Cohen is an admitted felon, he is obviously being squeezed to smear Trump in return for a plea deal. Of course, lawyers are such honorable bunch, you can take his word to the bank. The bank that he admits to defrauding.

 
ubique13
 
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22 August 2018 11:20
 
Celal - 22 August 2018 11:15 AM
EN - 22 August 2018 04:44 AM

Of the two events, Cohen’s confession seems the most troublesome for the President.

So when Obama in 2008 is found to be in violation of Campaign Finance laws, he is only fined, but if Trump is accused of the same, it is a capital offense.  That is nice, dear!  Where did you get your law license? You can’t even separate what you wish to have happen and what can be allowed to happen legally.

https://www.politico.com/story/2013/01/obama-2008-campaign-fined-375000-085784

Cohen is an admitted felon, he is obviously being squeezed to smear Trump in return for a plea deal. Of course, lawyers are such honorable bunch, you can take his word to the bank. The bank that he admits to defrauding.

With all due respect, Celal, my grandfather was one of the first Jews elected to a judgeship in New York State, and I’ve grown up around some fairly sharp legal minds. That said, you have no idea what you’re talking about. And I say that with as much love as possible.

 
 
Celal
 
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22 August 2018 11:29
 
ubique13 - 22 August 2018 11:20 AM
Celal - 22 August 2018 11:15 AM
EN - 22 August 2018 04:44 AM

Of the two events, Cohen’s confession seems the most troublesome for the President.

So when Obama in 2008 is found to be in violation of Campaign Finance laws, he is only fined, but if Trump is accused of the same, it is a capital offense.  That is nice, dear!  Where did you get your law license? You can’t even separate what you wish to have happen and what can be allowed to happen legally.

https://www.politico.com/story/2013/01/obama-2008-campaign-fined-375000-085784

Cohen is an admitted felon, he is obviously being squeezed to smear Trump in return for a plea deal. Of course, lawyers are such honorable bunch, you can take his word to the bank. The bank that he admits to defrauding.

With all due respect, Celal, my grandfather was one of the first Jews elected to a judgeship in New York State, and I’ve grown up around some fairly sharp legal minds. That said, you have no idea what you’re talking about. And I say that with as much love as possible.

My grandfather was a farmer and I didn’t grow up around fairly sharp legal minds.  But I learned early on how if/then form of logic works.

 
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22 August 2018 11:45
 

Cohen is taking down with him as many people people in Trump’s circle as he can.  He protected himself by secretly recording conversations in case he was thrown under the bus by Trump because he didn’t trust Trump.  I am not defending Cohen as a saint, since he violated the attorney/client privilege and may be disbarred for it, but since he was likely to be disbarred anyway, then he will go down in a blaze of kamikaze glory.  I like the guy’s style.

 
ubique13
 
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22 August 2018 11:51
 
Celal - 22 August 2018 11:29 AM

My grandfather was a farmer and I didn’t grow up around fairly sharp legal minds.  But I learned early on how if/then form of logic works.

Oh thank God. For a second I thought I was going to have to explain Knights and Knaves…

 
 
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22 August 2018 12:49
 
Celal - 22 August 2018 11:15 AM
EN - 22 August 2018 04:44 AM

Of the two events, Cohen’s confession seems the most troublesome for the President.

So when Obama in 2008 is found to be in violation of Campaign Finance laws, he is only fined, but if Trump is accused of the same, it is a capital offense.  That is nice, dear!  Where did you get your law license? You can’t even separate what you wish to have happen and what can be allowed to happen legally.

https://www.politico.com/story/2013/01/obama-2008-campaign-fined-375000-085784

Cohen is an admitted felon, he is obviously being squeezed to smear Trump in return for a plea deal. Of course, lawyers are such honorable bunch, you can take his word to the bank. The bank that he admits to defrauding.

Where did I say it was a capital offense?  I said it was troublesome for Trump. The trouble for him is only beginning. Admitted felons can often testify and cause others to become convicted felons.  Cohen’s attorney indicated he was prepared to talk to Mueller about collusion and obstruction. Four close associates of Trump are now felons.  How can you not see this to be a problem for your Golden Boy?

 
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