How far down this path will the U.S. go before waking up?

 
unsmoked
 
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unsmoked
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12 September 2018 17:44
 

https://www.thenation.com/article/the-ways-to-destroy-democracy/  - (A WARNING FROM HISTORY)

How far down this path will the U.S. go before waking up?

Will the NRA and the military go with him all the way?

Even after silencing climate scientists and withdrawing from the Paris Accord?

Even after he declares war on the ‘enemies of the people’?  (like the New York Times, The Washington Post, PBS etc.?

Even if he hunts down and deports millions of hard-working people?

Even if he withdraws from NATO and the U.N.

Even if he talks of violence from Democrats if they win in November?

Even if he stages a massive military parade and appears in the grandstand wearing a military uniform covered with medals?

How far?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0gU9op16rjQ

[ Edited: 12 September 2018 17:47 by unsmoked]
 
 
Brick Bungalow
 
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Brick Bungalow
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12 September 2018 21:31
 

I don’t know but previous historical precedent is not encouraging.

 
hannahtoo
 
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hannahtoo
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13 September 2018 08:14
 

Here’s how I attempt to put the craziness in perspective: 

First, I try to listen to news with a critical ear.  So though I agree with much of the reporting of CNN and MSNBC, I am alert for how their reporting is designed to trigger me.  There is so much emotional language.  I try to figure out whether I just need to roll my eyes, or if I need to write to my Congressmen yet again.  Everything is not an emergency.  And unfortunately, the vast majority of Trump’s policies (not tone, but policies) would continue under Mike Pence as Pres.  I try to keep focused on the upcoming elections, rather than the daily carnival.

Second, after reading NPR and CNN and local news in the morning, I go to RealClearPolitics.com.  This site lists news stories from opposing sources, side by side.  Occasionally, I’ll read a view different from mine.  And some of them sound very legitimate, rather than outrageous.  (Yes, some of them still sound outrageous.)  I can see that people who read the Wall Street Journal would see the political situation differently than I do.  This is not crazy reporting.  I still may disagree with them, but they aren’t idiots.  So I can see where some my friends who have different political views are coming from.

Third, I try to catch and stop myself from justifying when I hear about Democrats acting badly or pushing ill-conceived ideas.  For example, I attended several Women’s Marches and felt they generated much positive energy.  However, when the group solicited me for a donation to disrupt the confirmation hearings of Kavanaugh, I balked.  The nomination of a conservative Justice who supports the incumbent President seemed a foregone conclusion to me.  And I do not agree that disruptive screaming tactics have helped the Progressives make their case.  In other words, I’m trying to keep thinking and not just take sides.  Another example is that violence by Antifa is bad, even though the motivation to stop neo-Nazis is good.  Also, though I love Bernie as a person, and I applaud him for bringing up issues, some of his solutions are just plain unworkable.

In sum, I try to not let panic overtake rationality, though I still get plenty mad and need to blow off steam sometimes.  I am trying to breathe deeply and forestall my hysteria, at least until after the November midterms.

[ Edited: 13 September 2018 08:16 by hannahtoo]
 
EN
 
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EN
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13 September 2018 09:17
 

We will go down this path until Trump is stopped.  The first step to stopping him comes in November.  At least one house of Congress needs to be flipped. The second step is in November, 2020, when he and Pence are voted out of office. I think impeachment is probably unlikely, unless both houses flip.  So the plan is to vote and get him stopped, and then out.

 
unsmoked
 
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unsmoked
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13 September 2018 10:31
 
EN - 13 September 2018 09:17 AM

We will go down this path until Trump is stopped.  The first step to stopping him comes in November.  At least one house of Congress needs to be flipped. The second step is in November, 2020, when he and Pence are voted out of office. I think impeachment is probably unlikely, unless both houses flip.  So the plan is to vote and get him stopped, and then out.

The history of demagogues, and Trump’s tweets and exhortations to his base suggest that if things don’t look promising for him in 2020 he may try to cancel the election - claiming to know about planned voter fraud, rigged elections in blue states, illegal votes, foreign interference, etc.  Would a Republican Congress let him get away with this since they will want to protect their own tax breaks, business deregulation, evangelical interests, NRA interest, protection for big oil and coal, big pharma etc. etc.  As Laurie Anderson sang, “Wouldn’t be the first time.”

“Wo. I am here in this place. losing. my eyes are closed. closed. birds are there. hearing something. shouting. my voice. (and yet, we could all be wrong. wouldn’t be the first time.) kumowaku ya . . . “

Read more: Laurie Anderson - Kokoku Lyrics | MetroLyrics

 

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EN
 
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EN
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13 September 2018 11:54
 
unsmoked - 13 September 2018 10:31 AM
EN - 13 September 2018 09:17 AM

We will go down this path until Trump is stopped.  The first step to stopping him comes in November.  At least one house of Congress needs to be flipped. The second step is in November, 2020, when he and Pence are voted out of office. I think impeachment is probably unlikely, unless both houses flip.  So the plan is to vote and get him stopped, and then out.

The history of demagogues, and Trump’s tweets and exhortations to his base suggest that if things don’t look promising for him in 2020 he may try to cancel the election - claiming to know about planned voter fraud, rigged elections in blue states, illegal votes, foreign interference, etc.  Would a Republican Congress let him get away with this since they will want to protect their own tax breaks, business deregulation, evangelical interests, NRA interest, protection for big oil and coal, big pharma etc. etc.  As Laurie Anderson sang, “Wouldn’t be the first time.”

“Wo. I am here in this place. losing. my eyes are closed. closed. birds are there. hearing something. shouting. my voice. (and yet, we could all be wrong. wouldn’t be the first time.) kumowaku ya . . . “

Read more: Laurie Anderson - Kokoku Lyrics | MetroLyrics

 

He will not be able to cancel the election. Period.

 
Jefe
 
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Jefe
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13 September 2018 12:23
 
EN - 13 September 2018 11:54 AM
unsmoked - 13 September 2018 10:31 AM
EN - 13 September 2018 09:17 AM

We will go down this path until Trump is stopped.  The first step to stopping him comes in November.  At least one house of Congress needs to be flipped. The second step is in November, 2020, when he and Pence are voted out of office. I think impeachment is probably unlikely, unless both houses flip.  So the plan is to vote and get him stopped, and then out.

The history of demagogues, and Trump’s tweets and exhortations to his base suggest that if things don’t look promising for him in 2020 he may try to cancel the election - claiming to know about planned voter fraud, rigged elections in blue states, illegal votes, foreign interference, etc.  Would a Republican Congress let him get away with this since they will want to protect their own tax breaks, business deregulation, evangelical interests, NRA interest, protection for big oil and coal, big pharma etc. etc.  As Laurie Anderson sang, “Wouldn’t be the first time.”

“Wo. I am here in this place. losing. my eyes are closed. closed. birds are there. hearing something. shouting. my voice. (and yet, we could all be wrong. wouldn’t be the first time.) kumowaku ya . . . “

Read more: Laurie Anderson - Kokoku Lyrics | MetroLyrics

 

He will not be able to cancel the election. Period.

He may, however, get re-elected simply due to electorate apathy.

 
 
EN
 
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EN
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13 September 2018 12:28
 
Jefe - 13 September 2018 12:23 PM
EN - 13 September 2018 11:54 AM
unsmoked - 13 September 2018 10:31 AM
EN - 13 September 2018 09:17 AM

We will go down this path until Trump is stopped.  The first step to stopping him comes in November.  At least one house of Congress needs to be flipped. The second step is in November, 2020, when he and Pence are voted out of office. I think impeachment is probably unlikely, unless both houses flip.  So the plan is to vote and get him stopped, and then out.

The history of demagogues, and Trump’s tweets and exhortations to his base suggest that if things don’t look promising for him in 2020 he may try to cancel the election - claiming to know about planned voter fraud, rigged elections in blue states, illegal votes, foreign interference, etc.  Would a Republican Congress let him get away with this since they will want to protect their own tax breaks, business deregulation, evangelical interests, NRA interest, protection for big oil and coal, big pharma etc. etc.  As Laurie Anderson sang, “Wouldn’t be the first time.”

“Wo. I am here in this place. losing. my eyes are closed. closed. birds are there. hearing something. shouting. my voice. (and yet, we could all be wrong. wouldn’t be the first time.) kumowaku ya . . . “

Read more: Laurie Anderson - Kokoku Lyrics | MetroLyrics

 

He will not be able to cancel the election. Period.

He may, however, get re-elected simply due to electorate apathy.

Then we deserve what we get.  If his insanity doesn’t motivate voters, we are beyond salvation.

 
Jefe
 
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Jefe
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13 September 2018 12:39
 
EN - 13 September 2018 12:28 PM
Jefe - 13 September 2018 12:23 PM
EN - 13 September 2018 11:54 AM
unsmoked - 13 September 2018 10:31 AM
EN - 13 September 2018 09:17 AM

We will go down this path until Trump is stopped.  The first step to stopping him comes in November.  At least one house of Congress needs to be flipped. The second step is in November, 2020, when he and Pence are voted out of office. I think impeachment is probably unlikely, unless both houses flip.  So the plan is to vote and get him stopped, and then out.

The history of demagogues, and Trump’s tweets and exhortations to his base suggest that if things don’t look promising for him in 2020 he may try to cancel the election - claiming to know about planned voter fraud, rigged elections in blue states, illegal votes, foreign interference, etc.  Would a Republican Congress let him get away with this since they will want to protect their own tax breaks, business deregulation, evangelical interests, NRA interest, protection for big oil and coal, big pharma etc. etc.  As Laurie Anderson sang, “Wouldn’t be the first time.”

“Wo. I am here in this place. losing. my eyes are closed. closed. birds are there. hearing something. shouting. my voice. (and yet, we could all be wrong. wouldn’t be the first time.) kumowaku ya . . . “

Read more: Laurie Anderson - Kokoku Lyrics | MetroLyrics

 

He will not be able to cancel the election. Period.

 

He may, however, get re-elected simply due to electorate apathy.

Then we deserve what we get.  If his insanity doesn’t motivate voters, we are beyond salvation.

No one deserves a second term of pillaging and plundering.  That being said, I hope the electorate realizes their role in preventing it.

 
 
hannahtoo
 
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hannahtoo
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13 September 2018 17:38
 

I can’t wait to see the anti-Trump ads in 2020.  I imagine video footage juxtaposing him contradicting himself with his own lies.  And his bullying statements and tweets.  His own words convict him. 

I just hope the Democrats can field an opponent who has solid government experience, no skeletons in the closet, and not an extremist.  The person needs to have a cool head, responding to Trump bluster in debates with humor, a la Reagan, “There you go again, Donald…”

 
unsmoked
 
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unsmoked
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14 September 2018 12:16
 
hannahtoo - 13 September 2018 05:38 PM

I can’t wait to see the anti-Trump ads in 2020.  I imagine video footage juxtaposing him contradicting himself with his own lies.  And his bullying statements and tweets.  His own words convict him. 

I just hope the Democrats can field an opponent who has solid government experience, no skeletons in the closet, and not an extremist.  The person needs to have a cool head, responding to Trump bluster in debates with humor, a la Reagan, “There you go again, Donald…”

https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/mind-in-the-machine/201609/the-psychology-behind-donald-trumps-unwavering-support

Even though this article was written with the 2016 election in mind, have another look while thinking of November 2020.  The last paragraph agrees with what some are saying here:

quote:  “So what can we do to potentially change the minds of Trump loyalists before voting day in November? As a cognitive neuroscientist, it grieves me to say that there may be nothing we can do. The overwhelming majority of these people may be beyond reach, at least in the short term. The best we can do is to motivate everyone else to get out to the booths and check the box that doesn’t belong to a narcissistic nationalist who has the potential to damage the nation beyond repair.”  (end quote)

Most Republicans will vote for him in 2020 no matter what.  For the next two years he’ll be doing things and saying things to find new supporters.  Isolationists who hate the U.N. and the World Court?  A Bible at his bedside or Joel Osteen invited to join the White House inner circle?  Approve a new $13 billion veterans hospital?  (the same cost as a new aircraft carrier).  Other?