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A Disturbance in the Force

 
hannahtoo
 
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hannahtoo
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17 October 2018 18:51
 

I offer my condolences as well for the death of the horse you cared for.

I agree that there are a lot of aspects of nature that we do not understand. However, I tend to think Jan’s explanation about harboring some worry over the fate of the horse could have triggered the dream, and the death is probably a coincidence. 

There is a sort of “force,” but it is within our minds and shared with others in our social circle and our wider culture.  Its existence is illustrated by a description like, “the tension/excitement in the room was so thick, you could cut it with a knife.”  Another example is the negative or positive feelings of a crowd at a rally or concert.  It could have something to do with neural pathways within brains vibrating in sync with each other and/or with outside sources.  I think that entire natural or human-made environments can have a “vibe” as well.  And there can definitely be a disturbance in the force.  These sort of syncs are proximal, that is, strength inverse to distance.

 
icehorse
 
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icehorse
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18 October 2018 06:57
 
GAD - 17 October 2018 05:19 PM
icehorse - 17 October 2018 10:27 AM

Perhaps an important point here (just an extension of burt and jan’s points), is that in general we can discuss ideas like “the force” without any need to rely on deities or anything supernatural. We don’t know how most stuff in the universe works yet.

That’s the same reasoning theists, ghost hunters, witches etc use.

And particle physicists and cosmologists!

 
 
hannahtoo
 
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hannahtoo
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18 October 2018 07:42
 
icehorse - 18 October 2018 06:57 AM
GAD - 17 October 2018 05:19 PM
icehorse - 17 October 2018 10:27 AM

Perhaps an important point here (just an extension of burt and jan’s points), is that in general we can discuss ideas like “the force” without any need to rely on deities or anything supernatural. We don’t know how most stuff in the universe works yet.

That’s the same reasoning theists, ghost hunters, witches etc use.

And particle physicists and cosmologists!

Yes, I’ve heard scientists hypothesize about multiple universes in which various possibilities occur along continuously branching lines of time.  Stephen Hawkings’ last paper posed the idea of multiple universes arising from the Big Bang.  If one accepts this premise, the debate continues over whether these universes all have the same physical laws, or different, as well as whether evidence for these ideas could be found. 

https://www.bbc.com/news/science-environment-43976977

[ Edited: 18 October 2018 07:44 by hannahtoo]
 
GAD
 
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GAD
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18 October 2018 07:55
 
icehorse - 18 October 2018 06:57 AM
GAD - 17 October 2018 05:19 PM
icehorse - 17 October 2018 10:27 AM

Perhaps an important point here (just an extension of burt and jan’s points), is that in general we can discuss ideas like “the force” without any need to rely on deities or anything supernatural. We don’t know how most stuff in the universe works yet.

That’s the same reasoning theists, ghost hunters, witches etc use.

And particle physicists and cosmologists!

Um, so particle physicists and cosmologists are equal to theists, ghost hunters and witches? No, they are not equal nor proposing the same things.

 
 
icehorse
 
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icehorse
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18 October 2018 08:00
 
GAD - 18 October 2018 07:55 AM
icehorse - 18 October 2018 06:57 AM
GAD - 17 October 2018 05:19 PM
icehorse - 17 October 2018 10:27 AM

Perhaps an important point here (just an extension of burt and jan’s points), is that in general we can discuss ideas like “the force” without any need to rely on deities or anything supernatural. We don’t know how most stuff in the universe works yet.

That’s the same reasoning theists, ghost hunters, witches etc use.

And particle physicists and cosmologists!

Um, so particle physicists and cosmologists are equal to theists, ghost hunters and witches? No, they are not equal nor proposing the same things.

So how do you determine that speculation into the nature of particle physics and cosmology is different than speculation into “the force”?

I strongly suspect that the physicists are closer to the truth than someone speculating on “the force”, but I don’t how anyone could defend a certainty on that point.

 
 
GAD
 
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GAD
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18 October 2018 08:00
 
hannahtoo - 18 October 2018 07:42 AM
icehorse - 18 October 2018 06:57 AM
GAD - 17 October 2018 05:19 PM
icehorse - 17 October 2018 10:27 AM

Perhaps an important point here (just an extension of burt and jan’s points), is that in general we can discuss ideas like “the force” without any need to rely on deities or anything supernatural. We don’t know how most stuff in the universe works yet.

That’s the same reasoning theists, ghost hunters, witches etc use.

And particle physicists and cosmologists!

Yes, I’ve heard scientists hypothesize about multiple universes in which various possibilities occur along continuously branching lines of time.  Stephen Hawkings’ last paper posed the idea of multiple universes arising from the Big Bang.  If one accepts this premise, the debate continues over whether these universes all have the same physical laws, or different, as well as whether evidence for these ideas could be found. 

https://www.bbc.com/news/science-environment-43976977

I always love this reasoning, science doesn’t understand quantum mechanics and science says there could be multiverses, therefore anything I make up and believe is possible and justified.  No, no it isn’t.

 
 
icehorse
 
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icehorse
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18 October 2018 08:05
 
GAD - 18 October 2018 08:00 AM
hannahtoo - 18 October 2018 07:42 AM
icehorse - 18 October 2018 06:57 AM
GAD - 17 October 2018 05:19 PM
icehorse - 17 October 2018 10:27 AM

Perhaps an important point here (just an extension of burt and jan’s points), is that in general we can discuss ideas like “the force” without any need to rely on deities or anything supernatural. We don’t know how most stuff in the universe works yet.

That’s the same reasoning theists, ghost hunters, witches etc use.

And particle physicists and cosmologists!

Yes, I’ve heard scientists hypothesize about multiple universes in which various possibilities occur along continuously branching lines of time.  Stephen Hawkings’ last paper posed the idea of multiple universes arising from the Big Bang.  If one accepts this premise, the debate continues over whether these universes all have the same physical laws, or different, as well as whether evidence for these ideas could be found. 

https://www.bbc.com/news/science-environment-43976977

I always love this reasoning, science doesn’t understand quantum mechanics and science says there could be multiverses, therefore anything I make up and believe is possible and justified.  No, no it isn’t.

Not just anything.

 
 
burt
 
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burt
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18 October 2018 09:28
 
icehorse - 18 October 2018 08:05 AM
GAD - 18 October 2018 08:00 AM
hannahtoo - 18 October 2018 07:42 AM
icehorse - 18 October 2018 06:57 AM
GAD - 17 October 2018 05:19 PM
icehorse - 17 October 2018 10:27 AM

Perhaps an important point here (just an extension of burt and jan’s points), is that in general we can discuss ideas like “the force” without any need to rely on deities or anything supernatural. We don’t know how most stuff in the universe works yet.

That’s the same reasoning theists, ghost hunters, witches etc use.

And particle physicists and cosmologists!

Yes, I’ve heard scientists hypothesize about multiple universes in which various possibilities occur along continuously branching lines of time.  Stephen Hawkings’ last paper posed the idea of multiple universes arising from the Big Bang.  If one accepts this premise, the debate continues over whether these universes all have the same physical laws, or different, as well as whether evidence for these ideas could be found. 

https://www.bbc.com/news/science-environment-43976977

I always love this reasoning, science doesn’t understand quantum mechanics and science says there could be multiverses, therefore anything I make up and believe is possible and justified.  No, no it isn’t.

Not just anything.

“In the realm of the mind what one believes to be true either is true or becomes true within limits to be determined experientially and experimentally.” John C. Lilly

 
Cheshire Cat
 
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Cheshire Cat
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18 October 2018 09:57
 

Ice, what you experienced, Carl Jung would have called a synchronicity event.

Synchronicity is the coming together of inner and outer events in a way that cannot be explained by cause and effect and that is meaningful to the observer.
— Carl Jung

He thought that behind synchronicity was an underlying law that governed the whole of human experience and history and was evidence for his concept of the archetypes. Jung believed coincidences were not due to chance but a manifestation of this principle.

 
 
GAD
 
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GAD
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18 October 2018 10:06
 
Cheshire Cat - 18 October 2018 09:57 AM

Ice, what you experienced, Carl Jung would have called a synchronicity event.

Synchronicity is the coming together of inner and outer events in a way that cannot be explained by cause and effect and that is meaningful to the observer.
— Carl Jung

He thought that behind synchronicity was an underlying law that governed the whole of human experience and history and was evidence for his concept of the archetypes. Jung believed coincidences were not due to chance but a manifestation of this principle.

OK, I’ll scratch Jung from my reading list as he was a deluded crackpot.

 
 
hannahtoo
 
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hannahtoo
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18 October 2018 10:42
 

Sometimes traditions or superstitions are based on something real which is misinterpreted.  For example, several religions have incorporated hand washing rituals for millennia.  Scientists didn’t understand the germ theory of disease until the end of the 19th century.  So a true phenomenon may underlie a misunderstanding, and paying attention to the phenomenon could lead someday to a useful discovery.

 
EN
 
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EN
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18 October 2018 11:56
 
burt - 17 October 2018 09:21 AM

In the experience you describe, I’d take talk of quantum entanglement, synchronicity, and such as “occult mysteries,” and dismissive ideas of pure coincidence, nothing to it as “sacred (materialistic) dogma.” Both cases driven by the minds desire to have a comforting explanation that allows it to remain asleep.

It really should not be surprising that these types of events occur, given the interconnectedness of all things.

 
LadyJane
 
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LadyJane
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18 October 2018 14:39
 

Too bad about the horse.  I hope the unicorn is okay.

 
 
Jefe
 
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Jefe
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18 October 2018 14:44
 
EN - 18 October 2018 11:56 AM

It really should not be surprising that these types of events occur, given ...

...that our brains have built-in mechanisms that make these sorts of a-ha moments pretty common.

 
 
icehorse
 
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icehorse
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18 October 2018 14:57
 
LadyJane - 18 October 2018 02:39 PM

Too bad about the horse.  I hope the unicorn is okay.

I really appreciate such kind words, and coming from an admin no less!

 
 
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