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Can’t win for losing - being Black in America

 
LadyJane
 
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LadyJane
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13 November 2018 13:58
 
Jan_CAN - 13 November 2018 09:31 AM
LadyJane - 13 November 2018 06:45 AM

You have to imagine what it’s like to have no voice.  When nobody ever listens to you based on the colour of your skin or your gender or your nationality or less than enviable second hand clothes or some other perceived anomaly you have no control over.  When you live in a society that doesn’t recognize your needs you are never represented or accounted for and you are forced to live among those who do have a voice.  And can only hope they speak for you.  That isn’t equal footing.  If you’ve never truly struggled to be heard, to get a word in, stand up for yourself, often risking everything, you can’t possibly understand how it feels.  When the world is telling you what you say doesn’t matter.  What you think doesn’t matter.  You…don’t matter.  And it makes you invisible.

TheAnal_lyticPhilosopher - 13 November 2018 07:10 AM

No voice.  Nobody ever listens.  It makes you invisible
It’s almost amazing how people you claim to speak for would think you actually speak for them were you to discard the hyperbole that gives your advocacy its style and rhetorical force, while simultaneously draining it of any policy relevance. 

Now, if you are just speaking for yourself, then this former clinician suggests watching out for universalizing statements.  They are almost invariably a sign of dysfunctional thinking that causes more self-inflicted misery than not.

Hyperbole and dysfunctional thinking?  Not even close.  Her post indicates the ability to listen and to consider others’ perspectives – it’s called empathy and understanding.

This is the difference between listening and merely waiting for your turn to talk.  You didn’t read anything negative into what I wrote.  Which makes sense because it was never my intention.  (Thanks fer noticing.)  Wanting to understand and giving the benefit of the doubt is the only way to truly communicate.  The suggestion what I said has anything to do with policy is an amusing stretch.  The speculation about my emotional state is grossly inappropriate for anyone let alone someone claiming to be a professional.  And rather far afield of the ideal bedside manner.

There’s a common occurrence of filling in blanks with information that wasn’t provided.  I realize this is how the brain operates but what often happens when we fail to separate the posters from the posts is patrons insert their own assumptions in order to disagree with those they dislike and agree with those they do.  Making everything overly personal.  And deeply problematic when trotting talk of expertise manipulates the story. 

The original post is based on an article.  There’s no reason for anyone to think it’s about them. 

Or get all bent out of shape on account’a their white privilege.

 
 
TheAnal_lyticPhilosopher
 
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TheAnal_lyticPhilosopher
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13 November 2018 15:03
 

Yeah yeah yeah, blah blah blah. 

Now there’s going on and on about listening versus waiting for a turn to talk, personalizing, and filling in the blanks, and in support of the silly hyperbole the previous post has even been called an indication of “empathy” and “understanding.”  But it’s neither, because neither blacks nor women nor minorities of any stripe are invisible, voiceless, and listened to by nobody, with all the supporting “nevers” inserted to support the point (that’s the universalizing tendency any good self-help book will warn against).  In any case, there is no need to imagine—to wit, to empathize and understand—what it is like to live in such a state, for the state doesn’t exist (not in the US, at least; maybe it does in Canada?).  Instead, listening to the voices of those who experience the remaining inequities in our society, and finding their prospective solutions, requires not imagining what it’s like to be listened to by no one, to be rendered invisible, and to have no voice.  It requires a proper appraisal of the problems, nothing of which is captured by tiresome references to angry, self-serving fictions like white privilege.

As for policy being the end game, or not, I’m pretty sure the recipients of “empathy” and “understanding” would tend to say stuff it when it comes from us “privileged ones” absent something more concrete to rectify the wrongs they suffer.  They would rightly call such fellow-feeling “recreational” and not really that material to what needs to be done, absent some steps towards doing it.

[ Edited: 14 November 2018 03:27 by TheAnal_lyticPhilosopher]
 
bbearren
 
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bbearren
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13 November 2018 16:19
 
TheAnal_lyticPhilosopher - 13 November 2018 03:03 PM

Thus there is no need to imagine what it is like to live in such a state, for the state doesn’t exist (not in the US, at least; maybe it does in Canada?).

You are aware, are you not, that there are 50 states in the United States of America?

I dare say that you have never lived in any part of the deep south.

 
 
bbearren
 
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bbearren
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13 November 2018 23:00
 
TheAnal_lyticPhilosopher - 13 November 2018 03:03 PM

They would rightly call such fellow-feeling “recreational” and not really that material to what needs to be done, absent some steps towards doing it.

Voters kill remnants of Jim Crow in Florida and Louisiana

It is rather amusing that, when facts are entered into a thread, you tend to have no response.  Do read the link; it describes some positive steps toward doing what needs to be done, not at all “recreational”.

 
 
TheAnal_lyticPhilosopher
 
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TheAnal_lyticPhilosopher
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14 November 2018 10:24
 
bbearren - 13 November 2018 04:19 PM
TheAnal_lyticPhilosopher - 13 November 2018 03:03 PM

Thus there is no need to imagine what it is like to live in such a state, for the state doesn’t exist (not in the US, at least; maybe it does in Canada?).

You are aware, are you not, that there are 50 states in the United States of America?

I dare say that you have never lived in any part of the deep south.

You are aware, are you not, that you have not even divined the correct meaning of the word “state,” which should be clear enough in this context, as in (for your edification): the state of being “voiceless, invisible and listened to by nobody.”

I dare say you struggle with 3rd grade reading comprehension, so why would I even condescend to engage your [sic] evidence?

 
LadyJane
 
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LadyJane
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14 November 2018 10:51
 

Please defer all angry personal insults to the Funway.  As per the Guidelines.  Hall passes may be revoked at any time.  Thank you for your compliance. 

Game on.

 
 
TheAnal_lyticPhilosopher
 
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TheAnal_lyticPhilosopher
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14 November 2018 10:57
 

Point taken, but that trivial dig was the extent of my animosity.  I’m done with bbearren for the foreseeable future.

[ Edited: 14 November 2018 14:19 by TheAnal_lyticPhilosopher]
 
bbearren
 
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bbearren
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14 November 2018 11:24
 
TheAnal_lyticPhilosopher - 14 November 2018 10:24 AM
bbearren - 13 November 2018 04:19 PM
TheAnal_lyticPhilosopher - 13 November 2018 03:03 PM

Thus there is no need to imagine what it is like to live in such a state, for the state doesn’t exist (not in the US, at least; maybe it does in Canada?).

You are aware, are you not, that there are 50 states in the United States of America?

I dare say that you have never lived in any part of the deep south.

You are aware, are you not, that you have not even divined the correct meaning of the word “state,” which should be clear enough in this context, as in (for your edification): the state of being “voiceless, invisible and listened to by nobody.”

As I said, you have never lived in any part of the deep south, or you would be indubitably aware that the state of being voiceless, invisible and listened to by nobody is an undeniable reality for a great many people.  The “50 states in the United States of America” was a hint that you haven’t lived in all of them, and that academia cannot impart certain realities to those who do not live them.  Sorry that it went over your head.

I dare say you struggle with 3rd grade reading comprehension, so why would I even condescend to engage your [sic] evidence?

It goes without saying that I am engaged with one who exudes an aura of intellectual elitism; there’s no need for you to confirm it.  Similarly, that links I’ve posted in this thread aren’t position papers open for philosophical debate, but undisputable factual statements, establishes easily enough the reason for your lack of response.  It becomes difficult to deny that “White Privilege” is a thing to one who has personally lived it and readily admits the reality of it.  It’s no longer academic.

The first song Krista Hinman learned to play on the piano was Dixie, the de facto battle hymn of the Confederate States of America. She learned the minstrel-song-turned-slavery-anthem growing up in Southaven, Mississippi, a predominantly white suburb of Memphis, Tennessee.

“Everything I ever did was white,” Hinman, now 44 and a professional bartender, says on a southern-hot afternoon in the courtyard behind her apartment in Jackson, Mississippi’s majority-black capital city.

The Ku Klux Klan, the white gang that rose again to terrorize black residents during the civil rights movement, had mostly died down by the time of Hinman’s childhood – yet her neighbor in the 1970s had remained a member.
Was she racist herself?

“Oh yeah,” Hinman says. Born in 1974, she admits to regularly dropping the N-word and delighting in racist jokes with friends. “I was all in. I believed every single bit of it … all the ‘heritage’ stuff.”

She often regurgitated revisionist civil war tropes long embedded in southern textbooks: that secession wasn’t over slavery; that the war was a glorious uprising against federal tyranny; that slaves were happy and adored their masters until the Yankees up north riled them up. She also defended the Confederate flag and monuments.

Hinman’s parents did not want racist jokes and the N-word inside their home. Still, while watching the TV show In the Heat of the Night when she was a kid, she quipped that she might bring home a black boyfriend, angering her father.

“I would beat your ass to New York and back,” he said.

Many white southerners had adopted an uneven racial code since violent responses to civil rights gains in the 1960s. “He didn’t believe in total racism,” Hinman says of her father, “but you weren’t bringing [black people] home.”

But in her 20s, while studying at the University of Mississippi, Hinman’s views changed. She made liberal friends. Her friend Kiki described growing up on the black side of their wealthy college town, where whites seldom ventured and children enjoyed fewer opportunities. Hinman came to believe that racism is not just interpersonal name-calling, but systemic denial of equity and equality – in education, the workplace, political representation, housing, healthcare and everyday life.

Hinman realized that many whites are conditioned to believe lies that people of color were biologically inferior, more prone to crime, lazier. “It’s about a sense of superiority,” she says. “I might live in a trailer in Tchula, Mississippi, but at least somehow I can say I’m ‘better’ than these other people … We’ve done really horrible stuff to black people in the name of superiority.”

Today, she joins a growing chorus of Mississippians of wildly different backgrounds eager to talk about their racial miseducation in the hope to help bridge US racial divides – and that requires unexpurgated truth.

She now believes that the Mississippi flag and public Confederate statues memorialize oppression. “They all need to come down,” she says.”

Some more examples of those who live in “the state of being voiceless, invisible and listened to by nobody”:

Human rights organizations, as well as political and social ones, are condemning what they are calling a new form of inhumane exploitation in the United States, where they say a prison population of up to 2 million – mostly Black and Hispanic – are working for various industries for a pittance. For the tycoons who have invested in the prison industry, it has been like finding a pot of gold. They don’t have to worry about strikes or paying unemployment insurance, vacations or comp time. All of their workers are full-time, and never arrive late or are absent because of family problems; moreover, if they don’t like the pay of 25 cents an hour and refuse to work, they are locked up in isolation cells.”

 
 
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