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Possible sex-cue differences between genders

 
nonverbal
 
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nonverbal
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09 December 2018 16:50
 

The other day, I listed some characteristics that seemed to me to underlie sex-attraction cues commonly shared between men and women:
https://forum.samharris.org/forum/viewthread/71454

In this new thread, I’ll list a few characteristics that seem to me not as commonly shared between genders, and I’ll generalize in the sense that each item will have perhaps numerous kinds of exceptions. For the sake of this discussion, I’m not concerned with the exceptions, and I’ll hope to see everyone from the above thread, to straighten me out as needed or just to continue posting your original thoughts, which I appreciated very much during the past couple of days. Sex is a fascinating subject, no? I see no need to single out the inherent sex-attractions to specific body parts, as everyone already knows what that’s about.

GAD, if you object to something in my posts or others’ posts in this thread, I’ll expect and encourage polite disagreement, and I’ll ask that you not import disagreements from other threads to this one.

1. Both men and women seem attracted to cues that signal youthfulness, but men seem to appreciate youth cues more strongly than women do.

2. Women seem to appreciate strongly toned and somewhat linear muscle, while men tend to appreciate soft curves instead. (This one is probably overly obvious, yet I don’t have any idea how universal it might be.)

3. Women seek physical protection from a man. Men seek physical support from a woman.

4. Both men and women seem to have an eye for visual beauty, but men have it more persistently than women do.

5. Women seem more flexible in their attractions to men’s physiques than men are with women’s.

6. Women seem more engaged with men’s personalities than do men toward women’s.

 
 
GAD
 
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09 December 2018 23:04
 

I’m always polite, unless you take being honest and direct as impolite.

 
 
Jan_CAN
 
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10 December 2018 08:46
 
nonverbal - 09 December 2018 04:50 PM

...
1. Both men and women seem attracted to cues that signal youthfulness, but men seem to appreciate youth cues more strongly than women do.

2. Women seem to appreciate strongly toned and somewhat linear muscle, while men tend to appreciate soft curves instead. (This one is probably overly obvious, yet I don’t have any idea how universal it might be.)

3. Women seek physical protection from a man. Men seek physical support from a woman.

4. Both men and women seem to have an eye for visual beauty, but men have it more persistently than women do.

5. Women seem more flexible in their attractions to men’s physiques than men are with women’s.

6. Women seem more engaged with men’s personalities than do men toward women’s.

Yes, sex is a fascinating subject.

Perhaps also ...
7.  Women like a man to make her feel beautiful and interesting; men like a woman to make him feel strong and competent/successful.

Of course, there are those qualities that affect initial attraction, and others that become more apparent and attractive with just a little time.  Also, the changing roles of men and women have had an effect on our instincts, e.g. some women are attracted to a slender man in a well-cut suit who isn’t particularly physically strong (as per #5).  In addition, as women have become more financially independent, protection and being ‘looked after’ are less important.

[ Edited: 10 December 2018 08:51 by Jan_CAN]
 
 
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10 December 2018 10:21
 
nonverbal - 09 December 2018 04:50 PM

...
4. Both men and women seem to have an eye for visual beauty, but men have it more persistently than women do.

5. Women seem more flexible in their attractions to men’s physiques than men are with women’s.
...

Perhaps it’s just that men are simple and women more complex.  An individual woman might be simultaneously turned on by such men as:  Sean Connery and Norman Reedus ... Brad Pitt and James Gandolfini ... Denzel Washington, Colin Farrell and Kit Harington ...  As there is no man alive who embodies ALL of these qualities, we just have to make do.  grin

[ Edited: 10 December 2018 10:27 by Jan_CAN]
 
 
Nhoj Morley
 
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10 December 2018 11:15
 
GAD - 09 December 2018 11:04 PM

I’m always polite, unless you take being honest and direct as impolite.

No, but we do take taking the tenor of one’s posting for granted as impolite. It is not honest and direct to say that your posts of late have simply been honest and direct. Other adjectives have been heard. If we don’t share your perceptions, we cannot share your perception of your perceptions either.

 
 
EN
 
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10 December 2018 11:43
 

3. Women seek physical protection from a man. Men seek physical support from a woman.

Not sure what this means, so not sure I agree.  Men would like physical contact, to be sure. But “support” - does that mean washing the dishes or something else?

 
nonverbal
 
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10 December 2018 12:03
 
Jan_CAN - 10 December 2018 08:46 AM
nonverbal - 09 December 2018 04:50 PM

...
1. Both men and women seem attracted to cues that signal youthfulness, but men seem to appreciate youth cues more strongly than women do.

2. Women seem to appreciate strongly toned and somewhat linear muscle, while men tend to appreciate soft curves instead. (This one is probably overly obvious, yet I don’t have any idea how universal it might be.)

3. Women seek physical protection from a man. Men seek physical support from a woman.

4. Both men and women seem to have an eye for visual beauty, but men have it more persistently than women do.

5. Women seem more flexible in their attractions to men’s physiques than men are with women’s.

6. Women seem more engaged with men’s personalities than do men toward women’s.

Yes, sex is a fascinating subject.

Perhaps also ...
7.  Women like a man to make her feel beautiful and interesting; men like a woman to make him feel strong and competent/successful.

Of course, there are those qualities that affect initial attraction, and others that become more apparent and attractive with just a little time.  Also, the changing roles of men and women have had an effect on our instincts, e.g. some women are attracted to a slender man in a well-cut suit who isn’t particularly physically strong (as per #5).  In addition, as women have become more financially independent, protection and being ‘looked after’ are less important.

That rings true for me, Jan. Navigating the scene, however, can be hazardous or at least very challenging. (But it’s all challenging for me.)

 
 
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10 December 2018 12:04
 
Jan_CAN - 10 December 2018 10:21 AM
nonverbal - 09 December 2018 04:50 PM

...
4. Both men and women seem to have an eye for visual beauty, but men have it more persistently than women do.

5. Women seem more flexible in their attractions to men’s physiques than men are with women’s.
...

Perhaps it’s just that men are simple and women more complex.  An individual woman might be simultaneously turned on by such men as:  Sean Connery and Norman Reedus ... Brad Pitt and James Gandolfini ... Denzel Washington, Colin Farrell and Kit Harington ...  As there is no man alive who embodies ALL of these qualities, we just have to make do.  grin

Simple/complex how, cognitively or emotionally speaking?

 
 
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10 December 2018 12:06
 
EN - 10 December 2018 11:43 AM

3. Women seek physical protection from a man. Men seek physical support from a woman.

Not sure what this means, so not sure I agree.  Men would like physical contact, to be sure. But “support” - does that mean washing the dishes or something else?

Okay, let’s take you, Bruce. How much do you rely on your wife to physically support you? My best guess is that you’re fully able and willing to carry out any common household task that comes your way. Am I correct?

 
 
Jan_CAN
 
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10 December 2018 14:05
 
nonverbal - 10 December 2018 12:03 PM
Jan_CAN - 10 December 2018 08:46 AM

Perhaps also ...
7.  Women like a man to make her feel beautiful and interesting; men like a woman to make him feel strong and competent/successful.

Of course, there are those qualities that affect initial attraction, and others that become more apparent and attractive with just a little time.  Also, the changing roles of men and women have had an effect on our instincts, e.g. some women are attracted to a slender man in a well-cut suit who isn’t particularly physically strong (as per #5).  In addition, as women have become more financially independent, protection and being ‘looked after’ are less important.

That rings true for me, Jan. Navigating the scene, however, can be hazardous or at least very challenging. (But it’s all challenging for me.)

I often tend to see things rather simply.  If someone (male or female) is comfortable in their own skin, is polite and kind, shows that they enjoy the other’s company, has a sense of humour or at least the ability to laugh at ease, then they will be attractive to someone.  But then, I haven’t “navigated the scene” for a long time.

 
 
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10 December 2018 14:07
 
nonverbal - 10 December 2018 12:04 PM
Jan_CAN - 10 December 2018 10:21 AM
nonverbal - 09 December 2018 04:50 PM

...
4. Both men and women seem to have an eye for visual beauty, but men have it more persistently than women do.

5. Women seem more flexible in their attractions to men’s physiques than men are with women’s.
...

Perhaps it’s just that men are simple and women more complex.  An individual woman might be simultaneously turned on by such men as:  Sean Connery and Norman Reedus ... Brad Pitt and James Gandolfini ... Denzel Washington, Colin Farrell and Kit Harington ...  As there is no man alive who embodies ALL of these qualities, we just have to make do.  grin

Simple/complex how, cognitively or emotionally speaking?

I guess I’m speaking more about emotionally, instinctually.  (As I’m sure you’re aware, I was being a little facetious in that last post.)  However, I think I could pick out a photo of a woman that most men would find attractive; it would be more difficult to pick out such a photo for women.  It seems to me that many men are trying to figure out what women want; perhaps sometimes we don’t know.  We just know it when we feel it.

[ Edited: 10 December 2018 16:41 by Jan_CAN]
 
 
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10 December 2018 16:17
 
Nhoj Morley - 10 December 2018 11:15 AM
GAD - 09 December 2018 11:04 PM

I’m always polite, unless you take being honest and direct as impolite.

No, but we do take taking the tenor of one’s posting for granted as impolite. It is not honest and direct to say that your posts of late have simply been honest and direct. Other adjectives have been heard. If we don’t share your perceptions, we cannot share your perception of your perceptions either.

If I think someones view is wrong I say so, no PC bullshit, that is being honest and direct about my feeling of their views.

 
 
EN
 
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10 December 2018 18:00
 
nonverbal - 10 December 2018 12:06 PM
EN - 10 December 2018 11:43 AM

3. Women seek physical protection from a man. Men seek physical support from a woman.

Not sure what this means, so not sure I agree.  Men would like physical contact, to be sure. But “support” - does that mean washing the dishes or something else?

Okay, let’s take you, Bruce. How much do you rely on your wife to physically support you? My best guess is that you’re fully able and willing to carry out any common household task that comes your way. Am I correct?

I’m basically self-sufficient.  That’s why “physical support” is confusing to me.

 
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10 December 2018 18:24
 

I think that some of the most interesting “sex-cues” are completely unconscious.

I read about an international study that involved showing men from different cultures and races diagrams of women’s bodies. The vast majority of men picked one particular diagram which had a very specific hip-to-waist ratio. The scientists believed that this was the optimal female body type for child bearing. Somehow the men knew this intuitively. It turns out that Marylin Monroe and Kate Moss both share that ratio, even though their bodies are very different.

There was another study done where young women were asked to sleep wearing a tee-shirt for one night. The scientists took these tee-shirts and had men smell them and rate them on how pleasing they found the scent to be. The majority of men picked the tee-shirt worn by women who were ovulating the night they wore the shirts.

Yet another study looked at young women who went to night clubs. They tested their blood to see where they were in their monthly cycle and noted what clothing they were wearing before they went out. It turned out that the women who were ovulating wore outfits that revealed more of their skin than their non-ovulating friends.

There are things going on between males and females that don’t even hit the conscious level, yet they affect our behavior.

 
 
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10 December 2018 18:32
 
EN - 10 December 2018 06:00 PM
nonverbal - 10 December 2018 12:06 PM
EN - 10 December 2018 11:43 AM

3. Women seek physical protection from a man. Men seek physical support from a woman.

Not sure what this means, so not sure I agree.  Men would like physical contact, to be sure. But “support” - does that mean washing the dishes or something else?

Okay, let’s take you, Bruce. How much do you rely on your wife to physically support you? My best guess is that you’re fully able and willing to carry out any common household task that comes your way. Am I correct?

I’m basically self-sufficient.  That’s why “physical support” is confusing to me.

How many of your male neighbors are as self-sufficient as you?

 
 
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10 December 2018 18:36
 
Jan_CAN - 10 December 2018 10:21 AM

Perhaps it’s just that men are simple and women more complex.

Yes. When a man “sees” a hot woman his natural thought is hot sex, not how to woo her, court her, plan their wedding, number of children, how he will work to provide for her, come home and she’ll have the house clean and dinner ready, tuck the children in bed with a story and then drift asleep thinking about how they will be together through old age until death do them part, he just wanted hot sex for gods sake not an 80 year plan, that evolves in tiny pieces over the course of much more hot sex, maybe, or until it’s ruined by a baby.

 
 
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