The Looking Glass Universe

 
Cheshire Cat
 
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Cheshire Cat
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11 January 2019 17:13
 

“How would you like to live in Looking-glass House, Kitty? … Oh, Kitty! how nice it would be if we could only get through into Looking- glass House! I’m sure it’s got, oh! such beautiful things in it!”
Alice Through the Looking Glass, by Lewis Carrol

Researchers Latham Boyle, Kieran Finn and Neil Turok at the Perimeter Institute for Theoretical Physics in Waterloo, Ontario, … propose a previous universe that was a mirror image of our current one, except with everything reversed. Time went backward and particles were antiparticles.

Imagine cracking an egg in this anti-universe. First, it would be made entirely of negatively charged antiprotons and positively charged anti-electrons. Secondly, from our perspective in time, it would seem to go from a puddle of yolk to a cracked egg to an uncracked egg to inside the chicken. Similarly, the universe would go from exploding outward to a Big Bang singularity and then exploding into our universe.

But seen another way, both universes were created at the Big Bang and exploded simultaneously backward and forward in time. This dichotomy allows for some creative explanations to problems that have stumped physicists for years. For one, it would make the first second of the universe fairly simple, removing the necessity for the bizarre multiverses and dimensions experts have used for three decades to explain some of the stickier aspects of quantum physics and the Standard Model, which describes the zoo of subatomic particles that make up our universe.

Apparently this new theory would help explain Dark Matter and could possibly be tested to see if it is valid.

What would happen to cause and effect? Which universe would be running the “right” way? Would all things be predetermined, and doubly so?

https://www.livescience.com/64470-universe-has-mirror-image-universe.html

 

[ Edited: 11 January 2019 18:29 by Cheshire Cat]
 
 
hannahtoo
 
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hannahtoo
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12 January 2019 16:00
 

I am probably not understanding at all.  But I don’t see how time could run backward…Wouldn’t that mean there was an end that it was running backward from?  Is there an end of time?  And wouldn’t that mean that everything already happened—in order for it to go backwards from there?

 
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12 January 2019 17:06
 
hannahtoo - 12 January 2019 04:00 PM

I am probably not understanding at all.  But I don’t see how time could run backward…Wouldn’t that mean there was an end that it was running backward from?  Is there an end of time?  And wouldn’t that mean that everything already happened—in order for it to go backwards from there?

Yes, all good questions hannahtoo. I have no idea what the answers are. I agree with you that it seems that all things would have to be predetermined if this theory is true.

One of the things about this sort of cosmology is that it is totally abstract. The physicists are working on complex mathematical equations and models which are trying to describe and match what is known scientifically about the universe. These theories also make predictions which help in either proving them true or false. What these theoretical scientists are doing is similar to trying to solve a gigantic jigsaw puzzle with most of the pieces missing; you try to figure our what the missing pieces are like and how they fit into a larger picture, even though you don’t know what that picture looks like.

This idea was so strange and original, that I thought I’d share it here. It would have many disturbing implications if it turned out to be valid.

 
 
LadyJane
 
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13 January 2019 12:28
 

The headline teases.  Then goes on to describe a universe that exists before the Big Bang running backward in time imploding into the Big Bang, and our universe exploding out of the Big Bang moving forward in time.

After the catchy journalistic bizarreness the point is clarified by stating both universes were created simultaneously at the Big Bang.  With one moving “forward” and one moving “backward” in time.  But that’s not quite right either.

Each universe is moving forward in time, from its perspective, starting from the Big Bang moving through time towards the end of the universe.  If you could peer into the alternate universe, with everything being opposite, it would appear as though time was in reverse.  And if you were in that universe, peering into ours, you would witness the same reversal. 

The perception is relative wherever you happen to be.  Time is moving forward in both universes.  It only appears backward through the looking glass.

 
 
EN
 
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13 January 2019 12:52
 

If universes are simulations, this makes a lot of sense.

 
hannahtoo
 
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13 January 2019 16:08
 

What force would cause a cracked-open chicken egg to reassemble?  What logic would explain all effects preceding their causes?

 
Cheshire Cat
 
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13 January 2019 19:36
 
hannahtoo - 13 January 2019 04:08 PM

What force would cause a cracked-open chicken egg to reassemble?  What logic would explain all effects preceding their causes?

I was wondering the same thing. I found this youtube video which touches on anti-matter and time running backwards. It clarifies things somewhat. And Lady Jane is right, in the anti-matter universe, time would seem to move forward the way it does in our universe, and we would appear to be moving backwards in time. There is an odd introduction from someone who thinks that consciousness is anti-matter, or something like that. Just ignore that part. The rest of the video features Michio Kaku and Max Tegmark. It’s not very long.

https://tinyurl.com/y99nm5ys

 
 
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14 January 2019 10:40
 
hannahtoo - 13 January 2019 04:08 PM

What force would cause a cracked-open chicken egg to reassemble?  What logic would explain all effects preceding their causes?

If you were in this universe, this would be the norm. Our universe would seem strange. This would simply be the direction everything flowed and you would not think it absurd.

 
Brick Bungalow
 
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15 January 2019 07:33
 
hannahtoo - 12 January 2019 04:00 PM

I am probably not understanding at all.  But I don’t see how time could run backward…Wouldn’t that mean there was an end that it was running backward from?  Is there an end of time?  And wouldn’t that mean that everything already happened—in order for it to go backwards from there?

I don’t think anyone can understand at the level of intuition. The best analogy I’ve heard is about two dimensional creatures observing a three dimensional object. It appears from nowhere, expands, contracts and then disappears. Similarly N dimensional objects would behave, to us in our 3 space, 1 time dimension universe in paradoxical ways because we do not perceive the context in which they operate.

‘Backwards’ is probably a misleading word. I think it’s more a case of events being simultaneous on the large scale and moving in all directions. Our sequence being only one possible iteration out of endless possibilities.

 
hannahtoo
 
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15 January 2019 07:48
 

It is my understanding that our universe moves toward greater entropy, which is greater dispersion of energy.  Gravity pulls Humpty Dumpty off the wall and cracks him open into a million pieces, increasing entropy.  The Looking Glass Universe would imply anti-gravity and anti-entropy causing the self-assembly of Humpty and pushing him back up onto the wall.  While I can fathom anti-gravity repelling, rather than attracting, I can’t imagine how the pieces of Humpty could be directed to assemble into his form.

I do see that we’re discussing something extremely esoteric and complex on the basis of a pop sci explanation.  But, heck, why not, I guess?  I see implications that the earth’s first cells, with DNA/RNA replication, could have arisen through Looking Glass processes.

 
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15 January 2019 07:54
 
hannahtoo - 15 January 2019 07:48 AM

It is my understanding that our universe moves toward greater entropy, which is greater dispersion of energy.  Gravity pulls Humpty Dumpty off the wall and cracks him open into a million pieces, increasing entropy.  The Looking Glass Universe would imply anti-gravity and anti-entropy causing the self-assembly of Humpty and pushing him back up onto the wall.  While I can fathom anti-gravity repelling, rather than attracting, I can’t imagine how the pieces of Humpty could be directed to assemble into his form.

I do see that we’re discussing something extremely esoteric and complex on the basis of a pop sci explanation.  But, heck, why not, I guess?  I see implications that the earth’s first cells, with DNA/RNA replication, could have arisen through Looking Glass processes.

We know that there are local situations where entropy does not control.  That’s how we got evolution and the progression of species. All that is necessary for it not to apply in a larger context is for the natural laws of that universe to be tweaked differently than ours are.  What applies here does not have to apply there.

 
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15 January 2019 11:45
 
EN - 15 January 2019 07:54 AM
hannahtoo - 15 January 2019 07:48 AM

It is my understanding that our universe moves toward greater entropy, which is greater dispersion of energy.  Gravity pulls Humpty Dumpty off the wall and cracks him open into a million pieces, increasing entropy.  The Looking Glass Universe would imply anti-gravity and anti-entropy causing the self-assembly of Humpty and pushing him back up onto the wall.  While I can fathom anti-gravity repelling, rather than attracting, I can’t imagine how the pieces of Humpty could be directed to assemble into his form.

I do see that we’re discussing something extremely esoteric and complex on the basis of a pop sci explanation.  But, heck, why not, I guess?  I see implications that the earth’s first cells, with DNA/RNA replication, could have arisen through Looking Glass processes.

We know that there are local situations where entropy does not control.  That’s how we got evolution and the progression of species. All that is necessary for it not to apply in a larger context is for the natural laws of that universe to be tweaked differently than ours are.  What applies here does not have to apply there.

Entropy is temporarily overcome by input of energy.  My understanding was that, in the long, long, term, energy will become more and more dispersed.  As in, after all the stars burn out.

 
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15 January 2019 12:23
 
hannahtoo - 15 January 2019 11:45 AM

Entropy is temporarily overcome by input of energy.  My understanding was that, in the long, long, term, energy will become more and more dispersed.  As in, after all the stars burn out.

Cosmologists have nicknamed this “the Big Freeze.”

The term Heat Death comes from the idea that, in an isolated system (the Universe being a very big example), the entropy will continuously increase until it reaches a maximum value. The moment that happens, heat in the system will be evenly distributed, allowing no room for usable energy (or heat) to exist – hence the term ‘heat death’. That means, mechanical motion within the system will no longer be possible.

https://www.universetoday.com/36917/big-freeze/

 

 
 
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15 January 2019 16:52
 
hannahtoo - 15 January 2019 11:45 AM
EN - 15 January 2019 07:54 AM
hannahtoo - 15 January 2019 07:48 AM

It is my understanding that our universe moves toward greater entropy, which is greater dispersion of energy.  Gravity pulls Humpty Dumpty off the wall and cracks him open into a million pieces, increasing entropy.  The Looking Glass Universe would imply anti-gravity and anti-entropy causing the self-assembly of Humpty and pushing him back up onto the wall.  While I can fathom anti-gravity repelling, rather than attracting, I can’t imagine how the pieces of Humpty could be directed to assemble into his form.

I do see that we’re discussing something extremely esoteric and complex on the basis of a pop sci explanation.  But, heck, why not, I guess?  I see implications that the earth’s first cells, with DNA/RNA replication, could have arisen through Looking Glass processes.

We know that there are local situations where entropy does not control.  That’s how we got evolution and the progression of species. All that is necessary for it not to apply in a larger context is for the natural laws of that universe to be tweaked differently than ours are.  What applies here does not have to apply there.

Entropy is temporarily overcome by input of energy.  My understanding was that, in the long, long, term, energy will become more and more dispersed.  As in, after all the stars burn out.

That is true in this universe.  In another universe the laws of nature might be different.

 
hannahtoo
 
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16 January 2019 06:30
 
EN - 15 January 2019 04:52 PM
hannahtoo - 15 January 2019 11:45 AM
EN - 15 January 2019 07:54 AM
hannahtoo - 15 January 2019 07:48 AM

It is my understanding that our universe moves toward greater entropy, which is greater dispersion of energy.  Gravity pulls Humpty Dumpty off the wall and cracks him open into a million pieces, increasing entropy.  The Looking Glass Universe would imply anti-gravity and anti-entropy causing the self-assembly of Humpty and pushing him back up onto the wall.  While I can fathom anti-gravity repelling, rather than attracting, I can’t imagine how the pieces of Humpty could be directed to assemble into his form.

I do see that we’re discussing something extremely esoteric and complex on the basis of a pop sci explanation.  But, heck, why not, I guess?  I see implications that the earth’s first cells, with DNA/RNA replication, could have arisen through Looking Glass processes.

We know that there are local situations where entropy does not control.  That’s how we got evolution and the progression of species. All that is necessary for it not to apply in a larger context is for the natural laws of that universe to be tweaked differently than ours are.  What applies here does not have to apply there.

Entropy is temporarily overcome by input of energy.  My understanding was that, in the long, long, term, energy will become more and more dispersed.  As in, after all the stars burn out.

That is true in this universe.  In another universe the laws of nature might be different.

Can the laws of nature be anything?  Or are there limits?  Certainly, math can model anything, but whether mathematical functions can operate in reality is a different matter. 

For example, if time flowed backwards from the direction in our known universe, minerals would gather up and recompose into dead leaves on the forest floor, and the leaves would float up to the branches to reattach and green up.  Photons would travel back up to the sun from these leaves.  Eventually, the leaves would be reabsorbed by the tree.  Basically every dead human would be reanimated and then shrink back to babyhood a la Benjamin Button.  Eating would turn into barfing, except that chewing would turn chopped and liquidized food back into tomatoes and carrots. 

It’s one thing to say that protons would have an opposite charge or particles would have an opposite spin.  It’s another to say that time would run backwards.