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Racism Spectrum

 
unsmoked
 
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14 April 2019 22:42
 
Abel Dean - 14 April 2019 03:02 PM
unsmoked - 14 April 2019 12:48 PM
Abel Dean - 13 April 2019 10:42 PM

The trait of intelligence applies to individual organisms but not to groups and not to the species as a whole. Each individual has a brain, but the human species as a whole does not have a brain. Greater intelligence may benefit each human in competition with other humans, but the trait may not benefit the whole species. If greater intelligence will eventually kill the human species, then it would not follow that chimpanzees had greater intelligence. I wouldn’t put my money on nuclear obliteration, as handfuls of humans around the world are likely to survive even if every nuclear weapon detonated, but more frightening means of extinction are on the horizon. I would put my money on intelligent robotics that can reproduce and adapt quicker than I can pass a thought through my brain.

Try to imagine what it would be like to be born on the same beach, or among the same hills as your ancestors had been born for the past 65,000 years.  Then, as a child, imagine what it would be like to be kidnapped by unearthly pale men with hair the color of kangaroos, who kill your people with thundersticks and take you away to wear strange coverings over your body, to learn a strange language, to be subjected to long hours of inexplicable boredom listening to someone talking while looking at tiny marks on paper, and given unbearable chores chopping at the earth with an iron tool.  You know in your heart that this is the destruction of all joy in life, and everything good you have ever known.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lb13ynu3Iac

 

That is the “noble savage” theory, which has been popular among whites to shame whites for the last few hundred years. Thomas Hobbes ridiculed this idea in 1651 when he wrote this famous excerpt from Leviathan:

Whatsoever therefore is consequent to a time of Warre, where every man is Enemy to every man; the same is consequent to the time, wherein men live without other security, than what their own strength, and their own invention shall furnish them withall. In such condition, there is no place for Industry; because the fruit thereof is uncertain; and consequently no Culture of the Earth; no Navigation, nor use of the commodities that may be imported by Sea; no commodious Building; no Instruments of moving, and removing such things as require much force; no Knowledge of the face of the Earth; no account of Time; no Arts; no Letters; no Society; and which is worst of all, continuall feare, and danger of violent death; And the life of man, solitary, poore, nasty, brutish, and short.

The data of modern paleoanthropology seems to back up the claim of the last line, though anthropologists themselves may implicitly encourage the noble savage myth. When paleolithic human remains are found, the cause of death seems to be commonly homicide: clubbed skulls or pierced ribs. They may otherwise have died of starvation, thirst, or maladies that would be easily curable today. The average life expectancy of paleolithic hunter-gatherers is estimated to be 33, which is well below the average of every society living today, including the poorest. They generally do not return to that way of life, and it isn’t because whites have prevented it. Such a return would be nearly suicidal.

Granted, but I was thinking mainly of their time period on the planet as an intelligent species.  What’s so wonderful about whitey snuffing himself out after a few hundred years of technology?  Clubbed skulls and pierced ribs?  At the end of the Korean War one in ten North Korean civilians was a casualty - hundreds of thousands of men, women and children burned alive with napalm.  If 10 percent of U.S. civilians were killed, how many would that be?  32 million?

In his book, LETTER TO A CHRISTIAN NATION, Sam Harris suggested “that it is not an exaggeration to say that if the city of New York were suddenly replaced by a ball of fire, some significant percentage of the American population would see a silver lining in the subsequent mushroom cloud, as it would suggest to them that the best thing that is ever going to happen was about to happen:  the return of Christ.”  So the missionaries teach the savages how to live - replacing a 65,000 year-old culture with our brilliant flash-in-the-pan civilization.  http://time.com/5527944/napalm-girl-dresden-peace-price-james-nachtwey/

 
 
burt
 
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burt
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19 April 2019 17:41
Abel Dean
 
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Abel Dean
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19 April 2019 18:11
 
burt - 19 April 2019 05:41 PM

http://www.physanth.org/about/position-statements/aapa-statement-race-and-racism-2019/?fbclid=IwAR0ka5u90MiQMWM586zF2Y0izdxqIdhwEDfzyGbfD8T8F661lbVw5llDKKQ

The American Anthropological Association (representing a broader field than the AAPA) had a statement on race that was relatively circumspect, and it is harder to pin any fallacy on it. But, the AAPA’s statement on race cannonballs into a straw man full blast. They wrote as though biological races would be necessarily “biologically discrete, truly isolated, or fixed.” But, this model of races has never existed within any biological field, human or non-human, at any point in time, past or present, not even among racists at the height of racism. It is a pure straw man. Such a model of biological races did not exist before Darwin’s theory of evolution, and Darwin’s theory made the continua of races absolutely necessary. After Darwin’s theory, any claim that biological races are discrete would come off as not only absurd but impossible.

[ Edited: 19 April 2019 18:16 by Abel Dean]
 
Abel Dean
 
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Abel Dean
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19 April 2019 18:36
 

“The statement was unanimously accepted by the AAPA Executive Committee at its meeting on March 27, 2019 at the 88th Annual Meeting in Cleveland, Ohio.”

After decades of opportunity of debate, they didn’t even shift an inch, because they don’t debate racists. Their purpose is “to make the world safe for human differences,” not to find truths, and that means not even communicating with racists. It puts the community of American anthropologists at odds with the majorities of medical doctors, of forensic anthropologists, of evolutionary biologists, and of non-white anthropologists, who all take the concept of biological races to be a component of the theory of evolution, because obviously it is, and they take the human species to be no exception, because obviously we are not.

 
burt
 
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19 April 2019 19:40
 
Abel Dean - 19 April 2019 06:36 PM

“The statement was unanimously accepted by the AAPA Executive Committee at its meeting on March 27, 2019 at the 88th Annual Meeting in Cleveland, Ohio.”

After decades of opportunity of debate, they didn’t even shift an inch, because they don’t debate racists. Their purpose is “to make the world safe for human differences,” not to find truths, and that means not even communicating with racists. It puts the community of American anthropologists at odds with the majorities of medical doctors, of forensic anthropologists, of evolutionary biologists, and of non-white anthropologists, who all take the concept of biological races to be a component of the theory of evolution, because obviously it is, and they take the human species to be no exception, because obviously we are not.

Same old, same old. BTW, I didn’t post this for you, your response is predictable. But others here might well find it informative.

 
Abel Dean
 
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19 April 2019 19:48
 
burt - 19 April 2019 07:40 PM
Abel Dean - 19 April 2019 06:36 PM

“The statement was unanimously accepted by the AAPA Executive Committee at its meeting on March 27, 2019 at the 88th Annual Meeting in Cleveland, Ohio.”

After decades of opportunity of debate, they didn’t even shift an inch, because they don’t debate racists. Their purpose is “to make the world safe for human differences,” not to find truths, and that means not even communicating with racists. It puts the community of American anthropologists at odds with the majorities of medical doctors, of forensic anthropologists, of evolutionary biologists, and of non-white anthropologists, who all take the concept of biological races to be a component of the theory of evolution, because obviously it is, and they take the human species to be no exception, because obviously we are not.

Same old, same old. BTW, I didn’t post this for you, your response is predictable. But others here might well find it informative.

Yes, good. It helped me, at least. I did not know that the AAPA updated their statement. I was aware of their old one from 1996.

 
Abel Dean
 
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19 April 2019 19:59
 

I checked out what else was a topic of discussion at the recent AAPA meeting.

http://physanth.org/about/should-aapa-change-our-name/

They thought about changing their name, in part because “physical anthropology” evokes a racist past. The counterargument in the other camp is that they should own the ugly racist history!

 
Nhoj Morley
 
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19 April 2019 20:43
 

If I could, it is tempting to have page 19 link to page 1. You fellows have been circling around something or other for weeks now. There are clues to Mr. Dean’s Teflon coating.

Scientific racism has been the rage here since the Civil War. Prior racism had to be religious. Science was much more of a burden and one that racism is not up for. Science grants a patchy path that requires considerable DIY paving. A teaspoon of credit can go to practitioners for trying to be sciencie about it in the first place. Followed by a splash from a bucket of blood shed by those on the wrong end of such sciencie-ness.

How does this usually end for you, Mr. Dean? Is this now an endurance record for a forum? It’s my fault. I wanted to see what happens when the juice is exhausted and the thread becomes mobius.

 
 
Abel Dean
 
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19 April 2019 21:11
 
Nhoj Morley - 19 April 2019 08:43 PM

If I could, it is tempting to have page 19 link to page 1. You fellows have been circling around something or other for weeks now. There are clues to Mr. Dean’s Teflon coating.

Scientific racism has been the rage here since the Civil War. Prior racism had to be religious. Science was much more of a burden and one that racism is not up for. Science grants a patchy path that requires considerable DIY paving. A teaspoon of credit can go to practitioners for trying to be sciencie about it in the first place. Followed by a splash from a bucket of blood shed by those on the wrong end of such sciencie-ness.

How does this usually end for you, Mr. Dean? Is this now an endurance record for a forum? It’s my fault. I wanted to see what happens when the juice is exhausted and the thread becomes mobius.

In most active communities on the Internet, my opinions are not even granted the least tolerance, and I receive an immediate ban. Otherwise, the communities would tend to be far right, and they lack diversity of thought. This forum is unusual for the combination of its intelligence, its diversity, and its freedom of expression. I give it a lot of credit. It is not just another ideological echo chamber. I am learning from the experience, and I expect that my opinions and attitudes have shifted appropriately. We don’t tend to be directly conscious of such shifts. The changes are subconscious.

You may think that Darwin’s theory caused a revolution against religion in science, and that is only partly true. Before Darwin, there was an attitude common among scientists and natural philosophers to keep religion out of science, or at least to minimize the influence of religion. Deism was popular among them; they needed God merely to explain the origins of creation. The science of biological races follows in that trend. Science is not just a façade, but science is the foundational stratum of biological theory of human races. The grandfather of human racial theory is credited as Johann Friedrich Blumenbach in the late 18th century. His book about human races contained only cursory allusions to God and absolutely nothing about Christianity.

 
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19 April 2019 23:56
 
Abel Dean - 19 April 2019 09:11 PM


In most active communities on the Internet, my opinions are not even granted the least tolerance, and I receive an immediate ban. Otherwise, the communities would tend to be far right, and they lack diversity of thought. This forum is unusual for the combination of its intelligence, its diversity, and its freedom of expression. I give it a lot of credit. It is not just another ideological echo chamber. I am learning from the experience, and I expect that my opinions and attitudes have shifted appropriately. We don’t tend to be directly conscious of such shifts. The changes are subconscious.

You may think that Darwin’s theory caused a revolution against religion in science, and that is only partly true. Before Darwin, there was an attitude common among scientists and natural philosophers to keep religion out of science, or at least to minimize the influence of religion. Deism was popular among them; they needed God merely to explain the origins of creation. The science of biological races follows in that trend. Science is not just a façade, but science is the foundational stratum of biological theory of human races. The grandfather of human racial theory is credited as Johann Friedrich Blumenbach in the late 18th century. His book about human races contained only cursory allusions to God and absolutely nothing about Christianity.

I am aware of Blumenbach (tops in skullstery). I grew up watching The Ascent of Man over and over(on CBC). The book version is even better (he talks faster). I did not say revolution. I said rage as in fad or hot topic, which is what it still is here. Folk art.

I’m glad you appreciate your longevity here. It is only because I hold a different understanding of how you’ve gone wrong and I’m the lad with the hammer. I am a poor representative of the broader reaction you have received. The forum (and I) will pay a price for my indulgence.

I’m gonna ask you for a finale. Your pitch for the angels. You have to know what you are up against by now. Take one more shot that beats it all. Take your time. Then, take what you have learned here with you to your next arena.

 
 
Abel Dean
 
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20 April 2019 07:25
 
Nhoj Morley - 19 April 2019 11:56 PM
Abel Dean - 19 April 2019 09:11 PM


In most active communities on the Internet, my opinions are not even granted the least tolerance, and I receive an immediate ban. Otherwise, the communities would tend to be far right, and they lack diversity of thought. This forum is unusual for the combination of its intelligence, its diversity, and its freedom of expression. I give it a lot of credit. It is not just another ideological echo chamber. I am learning from the experience, and I expect that my opinions and attitudes have shifted appropriately. We don’t tend to be directly conscious of such shifts. The changes are subconscious.

You may think that Darwin’s theory caused a revolution against religion in science, and that is only partly true. Before Darwin, there was an attitude common among scientists and natural philosophers to keep religion out of science, or at least to minimize the influence of religion. Deism was popular among them; they needed God merely to explain the origins of creation. The science of biological races follows in that trend. Science is not just a façade, but science is the foundational stratum of biological theory of human races. The grandfather of human racial theory is credited as Johann Friedrich Blumenbach in the late 18th century. His book about human races contained only cursory allusions to God and absolutely nothing about Christianity.

I am aware of Blumenbach (tops in skullstery). I grew up watching The Ascent of Man over and over(on CBC). The book version is even better (he talks faster). I did not say revolution. I said rage as in fad or hot topic, which is what it still is here. Folk art.

I’m glad you appreciate your longevity here. It is only because I hold a different understanding of how you’ve gone wrong and I’m the lad with the hammer. I am a poor representative of the broader reaction you have received. The forum (and I) will pay a price for my indulgence.

I’m gonna ask you for a finale. Your pitch for the angels. You have to know what you are up against by now. Take one more shot that beats it all. Take your time. Then, take what you have learned here with you to your next arena.

That is timely, as I had in mind a topic perfect for that purpose: the Jewish intelligence advantage.

 
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20 April 2019 12:12
 
Abel Dean - 20 April 2019 07:25 AM

That is timely, as I had in mind a topic perfect for that purpose: the Jewish intelligence advantage.

Residents of the Lower East Side evolved to write more Broadway musicals than the Bronx’s Little Italy.

 

 
 
Abel Dean
 
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20 April 2019 12:20
 
unsmoked - 20 April 2019 12:12 PM
Abel Dean - 20 April 2019 07:25 AM

That is timely, as I had in mind a topic perfect for that purpose: the Jewish intelligence advantage.

Residents of the Lower East Side evolved to write more Broadway musicals than the Bronx’s Little Italy.

 

I am sorry, I am not sure what you mean. I am not familiar with New York City. Never been there.

 
unsmoked
 
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20 April 2019 12:37
 
Abel Dean - 20 April 2019 12:20 PM
unsmoked - 20 April 2019 12:12 PM
Abel Dean - 20 April 2019 07:25 AM

That is timely, as I had in mind a topic perfect for that purpose: the Jewish intelligence advantage.

Residents of the Lower East Side evolved to write more Broadway musicals than the Bronx’s Little Italy.

 

I am sorry, I am not sure what you mean. I am not familiar with New York City. Never been there.

For some reason, Jewish writers and composers produce more Broadway musicals than Italian writers and composers.

 
 
Abel Dean
 
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20 April 2019 13:17
 
unsmoked - 20 April 2019 12:37 PM
Abel Dean - 20 April 2019 12:20 PM
unsmoked - 20 April 2019 12:12 PM
Abel Dean - 20 April 2019 07:25 AM

That is timely, as I had in mind a topic perfect for that purpose: the Jewish intelligence advantage.

Residents of the Lower East Side evolved to write more Broadway musicals than the Bronx’s Little Italy.

 

I am sorry, I am not sure what you mean. I am not familiar with New York City. Never been there.

For some reason, Jewish writers and composers produce more Broadway musicals than Italian writers and composers.

Yes, and in fact Jews in white nations have an advantage over non-Jewish whites on average in every intellectual respect.

 
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