Running With Assumptions

 
LadyJane
 
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LadyJane
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24 July 2021 11:27
 

Ever wonder how many negative emotional connections are based on false assumptions? 

I’ve seen hundreds float by here at this forum.  A patron says something and without confirming the truth of it folks will believe or dismiss it based on how much they like or dislike that patron.  You can sometimes pinpoint the moment they stopped listening and ran with the assumption that fit that belief.  And watch as they never look back to confirm if it’s true.

This is the likely source of a lot of political strife.  The rift between perception and reality. 

These kinks don’t magically straighten out by themselves.  It requires straightening.  When emotion hijacks our ability to reason we tend to jump to conclusions.  And hearing what we want to hear is often more appealing than questioning the validity of the voices we trust.  Maybe doubling back and asking would create more positive emotional connections. 

Without retracing our steps once in awhile…how will we know?

 
 
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26 July 2021 06:26
 

FOX News is based entirely on this assumption.

 
PermieMan
 
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PermieMan
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26 July 2021 09:02
 

Complicating the narrative is the path to attain clarity so that discernment can happen.

 
 
LadyJane
 
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LadyJane
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27 July 2021 11:12
 

The most immediate example at our disposal is the belief that the terrorist attack on January 6th in the United States Capitol was somehow not exactly what it looked like.  The notion it wasn’t an insurrection but a lovefest in some alternate universe of imaginary thinking. 

Today’s hearing was rivetting.  Why would anyone not want to know the truth?  Guilty liars I guess.

I thought the election was the beginning of a turnaround.  Democracy inched its way to the brink and barely made it out alive.  The celebrations were short lived.  As though everyone was waiting for another shoe to drop.  Then it did.  And it again pushed its way toward the brink, hung over the cliff for awhile, then barely crawled back.  Some didn’t make it out alive.  But the election was certified and democracy survived.

Six months later there is still a concerted effort to deny that reality.  At a certain point even the most fervent supporter of whatever duped segment of the population that believes the nonsense must be starting to feel the fatigue of maintaining that far fetched pipe dream.  On what planet will Biden suddenly bring everything he’s doing to a halt and hand over the keys to the fat bastard who incited the riot in the first place? 

What will it take to turn it around?  It’s so stupid.  What has to happen for folks to get real?

 
 
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Jefe
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27 July 2021 14:55
 
LadyJane - 27 July 2021 11:12 AM

Today’s hearing was rivetting.

Well there’s not doubt in my mind, after viewing the investigation coverage and included video footage, that the Jan 6 insurrection was a violent and toxic uprising.

 
 
weird buffalo
 
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weird buffalo
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27 July 2021 15:20
 

There’s several things I can think of in regards to beliefs about the election.

1) There’s a strong Christian persecution narrative in some sects.  This is just more proof that they’re being persecuted.
2) Once you believe there’s a supernatural being who will alter reality if you just ask really hard… there’s really nothing that’s out of bounds.
3) A big part of some conservative ideals right now is “owning the libs”.  They don’t care about the things they are advocating for, just as long as liberals hate it.

I also found it amusing that me being mad at someone… caused them to dig on their beliefs.  They were essentially ceding control over what they would believe based on how I treated them.  Talk about feelings not caring about facts.

 
LadyJane
 
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27 July 2021 16:49
 

Any deflection from the telling of truth is pitiful to witness as it’s an insult to the intellect of those lying to themselves.

All the people claiming they live in a free country are the very ones making it less free for everyone else.  The ignorant racism and fear driven violence.  The reluctance to wear masks and get vaccinated.  Increasing conspiracy theories, victim blaming, and weapons galore.  It’s almost twenty years since nine eleven.  The last five have been what appears to be non stop civil unrest.

What if true believers were told they were unwittingly giving Osama bin Laden the last laugh?

 
 
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27 July 2021 22:24
 
weird buffalo - 27 July 2021 03:20 PM

3) A big part of some conservative ideals right now is “owning the libs”.  They don’t care about the things they are advocating for, just as long as liberals hate it.

I also found it amusing that me being mad at someone… caused them to dig on their beliefs.  They were essentially ceding control over what they would believe based on how I treated them.  Talk about feelings not caring about facts.

These!  As long as the libs object, then they are for it.  No thought or logic is required.

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Cheshire Cat
 
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28 July 2021 11:45
 
weird buffalo - 27 July 2021 03:20 PM

I also found it amusing that me being mad at someone… caused them to dig on their beliefs.  They were essentially ceding control over what they would believe based on how I treated them.  Talk about feelings not caring about facts.

If that’s aimed at me, you were the one with the emotional name calling. I finally got fed up with it and replied to it.

 
 
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28 July 2021 12:07
 
Cheshire Cat - 28 July 2021 11:45 AM
weird buffalo - 27 July 2021 03:20 PM

I also found it amusing that me being mad at someone… caused them to dig on their beliefs.  They were essentially ceding control over what they would believe based on how I treated them.  Talk about feelings not caring about facts.

If that’s aimed at me, you were the one with the emotional name calling. I finally got fed up with it and replied to it.

“I finally got fed up with it and replied to it”.

Yes, I agree.

To be clear, I got emotional because I saw people espousing bigotry.

You got emotional because I told you to stop espousing bigotry with a mean voice.

[ Edited: 28 July 2021 14:12 by weird buffalo]
 
Cheshire Cat
 
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28 July 2021 16:17
 
weird buffalo - 28 July 2021 12:07 PM

“I finally got fed up with it and replied to it”.

Yes, I agree.

To be clear, I got emotional because I saw people espousing bigotry.

You got emotional because I told you to stop espousing bigotry with a mean voice.

I personally don’t hold many things to be the gospel truth, including the Gospels. Most things are fair game to look at and to question, in my opinion. And, there are always spoken and unspoken assumptions behind every topic. Political, cultural, and religious prejudices and suppositions taint just about everything.

To me, something as fluid and subjective as gender dysphoria, is not a topic that can be nailed down in a scientific way, like Newton’s Law of Gravitation. You can’t get into somebody else’s head and know what they are feeling. It’s all subjective. There is a lot of leeway.

Merely questioning “trans orthodoxy,” is not espousing bigotry, in my opinion. I think Shier brings up some important questions.

You obviously feel otherwise, and quite passionately too.

The only “mean voice” I had was when I got pissed off at you. Outside of that, I have nothing but sympathy for trans people. That is a very difficult path to go down.

And I do agree that some people are born into the wrong sex, mentally, and that transitioning into the other sex is what’s right for them. But one should always be cautious about promoting something that can interfere with another person’s ability to reproduce, especially in people so very young, immature and often confused. There is no one-solution-fits-all approach.

That’s all I’m going to say about it, weird.

 
 
weird buffalo
 
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28 July 2021 21:10
 
Cheshire Cat - 28 July 2021 04:17 PM
weird buffalo - 28 July 2021 12:07 PM

“I finally got fed up with it and replied to it”.

Yes, I agree.

To be clear, I got emotional because I saw people espousing bigotry.

You got emotional because I told you to stop espousing bigotry with a mean voice.

I personally don’t hold many things to be the gospel truth, including the Gospels. Most things are fair game to look at and to question, in my opinion. And, there are always spoken and unspoken assumptions behind every topic. Political, cultural, and religious prejudices and suppositions taint just about everything.

To me, something as fluid and subjective as gender dysphoria, is not a topic that can be nailed down in a scientific way, like Newton’s Law of Gravitation. You can’t get into somebody else’s head and know what they are feeling. It’s all subjective. There is a lot of leeway.

Merely questioning “trans orthodoxy,” is not espousing bigotry, in my opinion. I think Shier brings up some important questions.

You obviously feel otherwise, and quite passionately too.

The only “mean voice” I had was when I got pissed off at you. Outside of that, I have nothing but sympathy for trans people. That is a very difficult path to go down.

And I do agree that some people are born into the wrong sex, mentally, and that transitioning into the other sex is what’s right for them. But one should always be cautious about promoting something that can interfere with another person’s ability to reproduce, especially in people so very young, immature and often confused. There is no one-solution-fits-all approach.

That’s all I’m going to say about it, weird.

Answering in the other thread.

 
LadyJane
 
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LadyJane
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30 July 2021 14:00
 

Thanks for redirecting that topic.  Circling back…I thought of more to say.

A girl who knows she’s a boy has probably known from a very young age and knows enough to know the benefits of avoiding puberty rather than waiting until eighteen or twenty or twenty five (or later) to begin the transition process.  A process that must meet a series of rigorous physical and psychological requirements every step of the way.  Including parental consent.  At each and every step.

After living uncomfortably in a body she hates, taping herself flat, having menstrual cycles, being forced to live in an opposite way, perceived by the world in an opposite way, experiencing life in an opposite way, patiently waiting a decade or two (or more) only to begin the process and experience puberty again, as a male, is nothing shy of torture.  Especially when she knew what she needed to know in the first place.  And living life was put on hold. 

I don’t think young girls are “confused” or succumbing to “peer pressure” when it comes to this stuff and it’s very condescending to assume that they are.  They come alive when they explain it and are elated when they make progress.  They are well aware of what they’re going through and that’s convincing enough for me.  We all make decisions and live with our choices.  Some have more regrets than others but the choices are ours.  This is theirs.  And it beats the hell out of suicide.

What happens between doctors and patients is confidential.  What happens between family and friends is private.  These relationships are essential.  And there’s no guarantee of support so the least society can do is support these people by reserving judgement and stop impeding progress.  Like any other minority being discriminated against.  Especially when it’s none of our beeswax.

Coz not every little girl’s dream is to grow up and become a mommy.  Like…not even close.